Pilot Edge Pilots Association

FSE and PE make for a powerful combination
Post Reply
jdzurisin
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:04 am

Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by jdzurisin »

Hi folks,

There has been a good deal of inquiry into the creation of a flying club for PilotEdge. Andrew Miller is currently working on a ground-up project to simulate this atmosphere. In the mean time, I suggest that we get started!

When this was broached initially I suggested the use of FSE as a fleet maintenance and realism engine as I have prior experience with this model in the Pacific Northwest with the Cascades Virtual Pilots Association (CVPA).

http://vwss.ca/cvpa/viewforum.php?f=12& ... 707d9dadf1

As such, I invite all interest pilots join the PEPA (name and acronym totally open to change BTW) on FS Economy. I will leave the group public to make joining easier.

http://atilla.hinttech.nl/fseconomy/groups.jsp?all=1

The next thing is to decide on things like bases of operation and aircraft. As I said previously, the CVPA operates on this not-for-profit model and has really had a great time. To get the ball rolling, I am able to create a no-cost leaseback situation to get the PEPA started with any or all of the following aircraft.


N36818 Aeronca Champion S43 $49 Dry
N147BC American Champion Scout CYYJ $49 Dry
N18677 Cessna 152 Aerobat W12 $49 Dry
N6555X Cessna 210 Centurion W33 $59 Dry
N209ML Maule M-7 S43 $49 Dry


In addition, for those of you that enjoy a more corporate fleet, you are welcome to join Glacier Aviation, which employs the following airframes (topic for another conversation):

N209PW Beechcraft King Air 300 KCCR
N614ML Beechcraft King Air 300 KTIW
N300AW Beechcraft King Air C90 5J0
N95TR Beechcraft Royal Turbine Duke B60 O42
N208GB Cessna 208 Caravan S86
N208X Cessna 208 Caravan WN76
N700ES Cessna Citation II KLAX
N306BR Pilatus PC-12 KOLM

So...that is plenty enough from me. If you are interested in taking your PE time to the next level (tough I know!), it is time to hear your voice.

Cheers,
~Jason
jdzurisin
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:04 am

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by jdzurisin »

Hey guys,

I wanted to take a minute to say welcome to Joe and Dan, to encourage others who may be interested to come aboard, and to talk a little about how we would like to proceed.

Regarding the last point, I think that maintaining a "flying club" model is a good way forward. The concept there being that we use FSE as a fleet management and maintenance engine and largely forgo the commercial features. This is not to say that pilots couldn't use the aircraft commercially, but as a starting point I have a model workflow for renting and using aircraft that I would like some feedback on.

-----------------

This post should be used to document use and squawks of NxxxXX. This is especially important if the aircraft is to be away from the field overnight. Squawks should be reported here so that other users will know if the aircraft is coming up to its 100-hour inspection or needs attention due to high engine wear.


The procedure for checking out NxxxXX is as follows:

1. Log-in to the FSE webpage

2. Go to the GROUPS-->Assignments-->PilotEdge Pilots Association tab

3. Create a new assignment for yourself that includes your departure and arrival points (can be the same). Leave the pilot fee at zero.

4. Add the new assignment to your current flight.

5. Rent NxxxXX and go fly!

6. When you return, make sure to turn in the keys by unrenting the aircraft.

-------------------

This would allow pilots to rent club aircraft at real-world rental rates and FSE simulates and tracks aircraft location, fuel usage, airframe engine and prop times, etc.

Thoughts?

~Jason
Keith Smith
Posts: 9939
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 8:38 pm
Location: Pompton Plains, NJ
Contact:

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Keith Smith »

That looks pretty cool to me!

One question I'd have is how the things will work if you do want to use the aircraft for commercial activity. Can we rent the plane from you, but fly the job independently of the group?

Another question, is it possible to charge a tach/dry rate on aircraft when they're being flown by group members, or are you going to invoice people and have them xfer cash?

There are holes in my FSE knowledge when it comes to certain group operations.
jdzurisin
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:04 am

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by jdzurisin »

Hey Keith,

Yes, yes and yes.

If a pilot wanted to use a group aircraft for commercial purposes, he/she has the option to fly it as an individual (being charged the aircraft rental and keeping any profits) or for the group (waiving the rental and only keeping a pilot % profit).

Rental charges will be billed automatically by the system on either an hourly or tach basis (we can choose) and dry or wet (pilot can choose).

It's all up to the group but is all supported by the system.

Cheers,

~Jason
Alex Stjepanovic
Posts: 1752
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 3:48 pm
Location: Novi Sad, Serbia

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Alex Stjepanovic »

Personally, I find the FSE being used as a central and mandatory feature as the major turnoff. I don't know much about other pilots on here, but I don't care for FSE one bit. If it was available as an option for those who wanna combine their flying in the club and the FSE, then I'd give it a second thought.
jdzurisin
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:04 am

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by jdzurisin »

Hey Alex,

This is a hard one to address as it is multifaceted. The original post regarding a PE flying club was authored by Andrew Miller regarding his longterm project to roll his own flying club plugin for PE. As he stated that development may be a lengthy process, I offered up FSE as a shovel-ready means of getting things started.

One important question to note is missing from both of these; What is an online flying club, and what do we want it to be?

The CVPA, as mentioned previously does not, at all, require it's pilots to use FSE. Instead, it's chartered purpose was to serve as a gathering place for General Aviation enthusiasts in the PNW and a sounding board for their interests online. I could see the PE version being very similar, or completely different.

At any rate, the backbone is there for those who are interested in participating in an FSE-enhanced club. For those that are not, that is great too. The important thing is to generate camaraderie and activity on the network...something I think we can all agree upon wholeheartedly.

Cheers,

~Jason
Alex Stjepanovic
Posts: 1752
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 3:48 pm
Location: Novi Sad, Serbia

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Alex Stjepanovic »

jdzurisin wrote:Hey Alex,

This is a hard one to address as it is multifaceted. The original post regarding a PE flying club was authored by Andrew Miller regarding his longterm project to roll his own flying club plugin for PE. As he stated that development may be a lengthy process, I offered up FSE as a shovel-ready means of getting things started.

One important question to note is missing from both of these; What is an online flying club, and what do we want it to be?

The CVPA, as mentioned previously does not, at all, require it's pilots to use FSE. Instead, it's chartered purpose was to serve as a gathering place for General Aviation enthusiasts in the PNW and a sounding board for their interests online. I could see the PE version being very similar, or completely different.

At any rate, the backbone is there for those who are interested in participating in an FSE-enhanced club. For those that are not, that is great too. The important thing is to generate camaraderie and activity on the network...something I think we can all agree upon wholeheartedly.

Cheers,

~Jason
I agree with the underlined part 100% - In fact, just recently, another individual here and I, have been debating and pondering over how well and in what form something like this would happen(The italics). We concluded that there were simply too many differences in opinions to satisfy everyone. You guys have however come along, so feel free to run it as you please - I'm just pointing out my personal preferences.
Keith Smith
Posts: 9939
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 8:38 pm
Location: Pompton Plains, NJ
Contact:

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Keith Smith »

I could see a hybrid where PEPA hosts a fly-in to a field, and it's attended by FSE and non-FSE pilots alike. That would be an ideal outcome that would probably satisfy the highest number of people.

With you being the founder of this specific club, Jason, it would be completely up to you as to how you run it. I'll be happy to help promote PE-oriented events that are hosted by the club.

Keith
Steven Winslow
Posts: 459
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 8:51 pm
Location: KBZN - Bozeman, MT
Contact:

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Steven Winslow »

I have to say that I too am not interested in FSE. I am, however, interested in some form of flying club not related to or dependent on FSE. I don't have any particular ideas or vision for what this club would be, but I never thought it would involve a plugin. My initial thoughts were that the club would plan and organize club activities such as fly-ins or assignments. I am not interested in "renting" aircraft. I understand the concepts behind FSE. I'm just not interested in adding that to my already somewhat complicated X-Plane life.
Steven Winslow
CEO/Owner - Air Northwest Virtual Airlines • http://www.airnorthwest.org
People should get what they want when they want it once in a while. Keeps them optimisitic.
Calvin Waterbury
Posts: 199
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2011 10:37 am

Re: Pilot Edge Pilots Association

Post by Calvin Waterbury »

Sorry for the late response, but I just discovered the board, let alone this thread.

My point in posting is the thread seemed frayed at the end and I like to see things hemmed up, but I will have to let you all do the sewing. I don't have an answer. I just wanted to reflect what others might see. :)

For sometime I was heavily involved with FSE and am presently on a self-imposed sabbatical (the jury is still out), so I have been on both sides. I recognize this discussion has been something of an open forum and people are "voting" and offering his/her rationale. Maybe I am missing something here, but IMO this conversation looks like an ultimatum-style "either/or" argument with people choosing "sides" to an outsider.

Seems to me PE can serve both camps and I doubt if the "scope" will discriminate whether someone is flying with FSE or without. Whether a "club" organizer(s) adds requirements (in this case, using FSE) or not is completely under his/her/their jurisdiction. One question I have is why someone would want to be a part of a club where the whole tenet is to add the quasi-realistic element of FSE and not use FSE? Thinking about it gives me a headache. Non sequitur. If someone can explain this to me, I would much obliged.

As I said, the jury is still out as far as me starting my FSE again, so I don't have a dog in this hunt, but I do care about PE and the community, mostly as a lurker. I am not trying to point fingers or condescend to anyone. I'm being a mirror. My two cents.
Windows 8.1 (64)
ASUS 17" Laptop
2.4 GHz I7-4700HQ CPU
8 GB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 860M
1 TB HDD
Post Reply