I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

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I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby mcdonaldc » Sat Jan 09, 2016 6:12 pm

Hello all!

I seem to be having trouble with a specific part of the I-3 Rating, and that is trying to intercept the SLI VOR after being given instructions to do so. If I wanted to practice this particular part over and over again, what would I mention to the
controller(s) handling my flight?
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby Pieces » Sat Jan 09, 2016 7:02 pm

I assume you mean the part where you are sent direct to SLI?

If that is the case, your best bet isn't to practice departing KSNA over and over again. There will be a lot of overhead interacting with ATC to get instructions, get vectored around, etc. Going direct to a VOR is the same for any VOR anywhere. It doesn't have to be SLI. To practice, I'd go somewhere in E/G airspace were you don't have to be talking to ATC, tune some VORs and go.

If you would like to be in contact with ATC while doing that, get flight following and tell ATC you'll be maneuvering near <XYZ> VOR.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby NameCoin » Sat Jan 09, 2016 11:21 pm

I agree. This sounds like a symptom of a deeper problem, namely not understanding to how navigate around and to / from VORs, and possibly what their idea is in the first place. It might be a good idea to search YouTube for some tutorials on what VORs are and how to use them, try a few examples on your own at other places, then return.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby stevekirks » Sun Jan 10, 2016 1:23 pm

If you're practicing, then I'd pick something like the Hector (HEC) VOR at 6500 feet. Practice joining the airways that use the radials, fly outbound to say 10DME then back.

Also:

http://www.luizmonteiro.com/learning_vor_sim.aspx
Steve Kirks (sKirks on Twitch)
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby Keith Smith » Wed Jan 13, 2016 7:43 am

Great advice being given, and I agree, don't attempt to replicate the departure from SNA, then direct SLI over and over. Practice the underlying task, which is tracking direct to a VOR from a random point in space.

ATC might say, "fly heading xxx, when able proceed direct [VOR name]," in which case you turn to the assigned heading NOW, then set about going direct to the VOR. This is usually done if your current heading is pretty far off the direct track to the VOR, it at least gets you pointed in the approximate direction.

Otherwise, ATC will just say, "cleared direct [VOR name]."

In either case, to go direct to the VOR, spin the OBS until the CDI is centered with a TO flag. The resulting number at the top of the OBS represents the magnetic course required to go direct to the station. Fly that course and you're good to go.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby Flying Penguin » Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:31 pm

This is almost certainly something better practiced offline.

My suggestion, load up something slow (e.g. a 172) and get into the air somewhere over central LA. You are now in receiving range of SLI, SMO, LAX, VNY and POM VORs and possibly others. Then just pick a VOR, tune it, pick a radial, intercept it, then repeat, until you can do it quickly and without fuss. Simple repetition in an area full of VORs so you can try in all sorts of directions and combinations without going very far.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby Keith Smith » Sat Jan 16, 2016 10:10 am

Jamie,

Even when I'm practicing procedures, I still fly on PE. I wouldn't agree that it's necessarily better to practice it offline. Looking for traffic and listening to comms is always good practice. I can't remember the last time I flew the sim offline.

In the real world, if you wanted to practice VOR intercepts, you'd takeoff from a towered or non-towered field, head out to an area where you could receive several VORs and then practice tracking towards them. There's no reason that couldn't be practiced online.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby Flying Penguin » Sat Jan 16, 2016 4:25 pm

True, there's no reason it *can't* be practiced online, but the centre of LA area is near unique in the coverage area in that the distances to the VORs are so short, and there's so many of them in a small area. IRL you probably aren't going to practice the basics of VOR interception in such a busy area (unless you are a nut and like the idea that one wrong move puts you into the Bravo), but in the absence of traffic and ATC it's almost the ideal VOR sandbox, much more so than (say) the area between TRM and JLI.. It's a basic mechanical exercise that can be drilled, a few intercepts then back to try the full flight again.
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Re: I-3 -- practicing one specific part over and over..

Postby NameCoin » Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:55 am

Flying Penguin wrote:True, there's no reason it *can't* be practiced online, but the centre of LA area is near unique in the coverage area in that the distances to the VORs are so short, and there's so many of them in a small area. IRL you probably aren't going to practice the basics of VOR interception in such a busy area (unless you are a nut and like the idea that one wrong move puts you into the Bravo), but in the absence of traffic and ATC it's almost the ideal VOR sandbox, much more so than (say) the area between TRM and JLI.. It's a basic mechanical exercise that can be drilled, a few intercepts then back to try the full flight again.


I completely disagree with the first part of your comment - you aren't portraying training in this area realistically. People train frequently and regularly in the heart of Los Angeles airspace and learn VOR navigation just the same as anyone else who has access to a station. You do have to be wary of airspace and other airplanes at times, but there's no reason you can't operate safely.
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