Why is this route not acceptable?

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bobsk8
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Joined: Fri May 22, 2015 9:02 pm

Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by bobsk8 »

Trying to understand when i make a flight plan, what is a good route, and what isn't. I made a route on Skyvector from from KCOS to KGJT. The route was Stamy V 108 DBL V 134 Paces. This same route was listed on Skyvector and also on PEaware and was used a month ago. Just trying to understand the logic of a route using airways and what is acceptable and what isn't, since I was given a totally different route this morning.
Licensed Pilot since 1978
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bobsk8
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by bobsk8 »

Keith Smith wrote:What route were you given?
The first waypoint was BRK, and I tried twice to write the clearance down, but it was given so fast, i couldn't keep up and finally decided to call it a day.
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Keith Smith
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by Keith Smith »

Fair enough. I'd venture to say that you could ask the controller to say the route slowly and to spell the identifiers, as you would in real life if having difficulty copying the clearance. As to why the route was changed, I'm not sure, but I can try to find out for you. When did this occur?
bobsk8
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by bobsk8 »

Keith Smith wrote:Fair enough. I'd venture to say that you could ask the controller to say the route slowly and to spell the identifiers, as you would in real life if having difficulty copying the clearance. As to why the route was changed, I'm not sure, but I can try to find out for you. When did this occur?
This happened this morning around 9 AM PST. I was a bit frustrated since this was my second attempt to start this IFR flight. The first time, I tried to fly it in the Comanche, but was told the route was too high if the Comanche wasn't pressurized, which it is not, so that made sense.. I then set the flight up again using the Lockheed Constellation that I fly alot, which took some time, and then ran into the total change of my flight plan, which I had looked up on two different FP sites after I created it to make sure it was usable. I guess my point is, if there is no logic to which plan works and which gets rejected, than I guess I am wasting my time carefully doing a Flight plan.
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by Keith Smith »

Unless your Comanche is good to 17,000ft, it's not going to work on the route you had filed because the highest MEA is 16,400. What altitude had you planned to fly the route?

Regarding the Connie, I'm guessing she's /A or /U for the equipment suffix (ie, no RNAV). Looking at the low enroute chart, BRK is on the airway you filed (V108), and is also the termination point for the ODP out of KCOS. So, my guess is the controller was giving you a flyable route given that you were sans RNAV.

Flight planning is absolutely not wasted....I get 'as filed' many times on the network when I file routes with the appropriate altitudes and a given equipment suffix.

It's a good idea to find out the reason why something didn't go as you'd planned it before writing off the exercise as being pointless.
rtataryn
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by rtataryn »

Even if your plane is capable for the route filed, it is not uncommon in the real world to get a complete reroute of what you had filed or what has been "cleared" previously for another aircraft. I flew out of PDX yesterday with a route that I frequently fly and they gave me a routing change with the dreaded, "advise when ready to copy", after I had everything loaded and was blissfully enroute flying with the autopilot, and listening to XM radio. Sometimes I'll get it while on the ground taking my clearance. ATC has their reasons and it's just the way it is. When it happens on PE, I love it, because it mimics the real world.
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bobsk8
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Re: Why is this route not acceptable?

Post by bobsk8 »

Keith Smith wrote:Unless your Comanche is good to 17,000ft, it's not going to work on the route you had filed because the highest MEA is 16,400. What altitude had you planned to fly the route?

Regarding the Connie, I'm guessing she's /A or /U for the equipment suffix (ie, no RNAV). Looking at the low enroute chart, BRK is on the airway you filed (V108), and is also the termination point for the ODP out of KCOS. So, my guess is the controller was giving you a flyable route given that you were sans RNAV.

Flight planning is absolutely not wasted....I get 'as filed' many times on the network when I file routes with the appropriate altitudes and a given equipment suffix.

It's a good idea to find out the reason why something didn't go as you'd planned it before writing off the exercise as being pointless.
I listened to the audio of my attempted flight yesterday and figured out some of my confusion. Firstt of all, when I filed the FP for the Connie L-049, I correctly stated on the FP that it was ( copied from flight-plan /I - RNAV, Transponder with mode C ) So apparently that R-Nav capability was not the issue in the route change.


Then I listened to the route I was given , and when I got this clearance yesterday I had a chart from Skyvector up and couldn't seem to find the route I was given on the Skyvector chart, namely J80 . Spring 5 departure/vectors to BRK DCT FQF J80 DCT JNC.

I went back after listening to the clearance this morning and still couldn't find J80. Then I realized that I was using Low altitude Victor airways all this time, and J 80 was a high altitude airway, because now I was at 18,000 feet. My mistake, and that is why the controller had to change the routing because the Victor airways I had used on my FP were not valid at that altitude. I pulled up the Hi Airways, and immediately found J80 and the new route made sense.

My apology's.
Flew it this morning , great flight.
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