If somebody can help me here figure this out as I keep on failing (three attempts) the I-11 ODP at PDZ HOLD.....my flight experience is a PPL student, so I have not had the IFR portion of flight training.
From KAJO, I enter the PDZ hold to gain altitude and fly the 030 radial for one minute making a right turn...
At 1 minute, turn right 180 degrees and fly back and when abeam of PDZ make make a right turn to join the 030 radial...
After another minute once past PDZ, make a right 180 turn....and by now I'm at 6,700 ft.
And this is when the SoCal controller (The "Russian kid"...now mind you everyone under 40 y/o is a kid to me) advises me that I have failed the I-11 because I am "south" of PDZ.
But I have been flying the PDZ hold by the numbers ( so I think)...
So where is the disconnect...what did I miss?
Thanks,
Matt
I-11 Hold at PDZ Problem - help
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Keith Smith
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Re: I-11 Hold at PDZ Problem - help
Matt,
The I-6 and and the I-10 contain parallel hold entries, which is exactly what you need to be doing here, so this should not be new material, the only difference is that it's not a graphically depicted hold.
I would suggest reviewing the first workshop we offer on instrument approaches: https://www.pilotedge.net/workshops/ins ... hes-part-1. Right at 1hr 30 mins and 20 secs you'll see a visual depiction of how to execute the parallel hold entry. The hold at PDZ is pretty much identical to this.
The I-6 and and the I-10 contain parallel hold entries, which is exactly what you need to be doing here, so this should not be new material, the only difference is that it's not a graphically depicted hold.
I would suggest reviewing the first workshop we offer on instrument approaches: https://www.pilotedge.net/workshops/ins ... hes-part-1. Right at 1hr 30 mins and 20 secs you'll see a visual depiction of how to execute the parallel hold entry. The hold at PDZ is pretty much identical to this.
Re: I-11 Hold at PDZ Problem - help
Hi Keith,
Thanks for the response, but the actual answer to my question is that I was flying the hold in the reverse with a 030 inbound leg instead of 210 inbound - thus I was on the other side of VOR and failed.
I realized this when you pointed out that I needed to fly a parallel entry - and I was thinking - "Now why would I need to fly a parallel and not a direct entry when I'm flying 030 inbound?" Then I re-read the ODP which clearly states: "Hold NE, right turns, 210 inbound".
Where I got lost (pun intended) was the verbiage in the I-11 description - "Otherwise, HOLD NE at PDZ on the 030 radial, right turns) to cross PDZ at or above 4000 (courses 141-230) or 6700 (281-090)." Erroneously thinking that 030 was the inbound and incorrectly flew the hold with a one minute leg once past PDZ on 030.
Thanks again for the quick response....this lesson was money well spent.
Matt
Thanks for the response, but the actual answer to my question is that I was flying the hold in the reverse with a 030 inbound leg instead of 210 inbound - thus I was on the other side of VOR and failed.
I realized this when you pointed out that I needed to fly a parallel entry - and I was thinking - "Now why would I need to fly a parallel and not a direct entry when I'm flying 030 inbound?" Then I re-read the ODP which clearly states: "Hold NE, right turns, 210 inbound".
Where I got lost (pun intended) was the verbiage in the I-11 description - "Otherwise, HOLD NE at PDZ on the 030 radial, right turns) to cross PDZ at or above 4000 (courses 141-230) or 6700 (281-090)." Erroneously thinking that 030 was the inbound and incorrectly flew the hold with a one minute leg once past PDZ on 030.
Thanks again for the quick response....this lesson was money well spent.
Matt
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Scott Medeiros
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- Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:49 am
- Location: Atlanta, GA
Re: I-11 Hold at PDZ Problem - help
Radials are FROM the VOR, Courses are TO the VOR.
If you're not already doing it, I'd suggest drawing out the hold to help with visualizing it. You can see how drawing a hold NE of PDZ, but also drawing the 030* course into the VOR would put you on opposite sides of the VOR, a clue something isn't quite right.
Hope this helps!
Scott
If you're not already doing it, I'd suggest drawing out the hold to help with visualizing it. You can see how drawing a hold NE of PDZ, but also drawing the 030* course into the VOR would put you on opposite sides of the VOR, a clue something isn't quite right.
Hope this helps!
Scott
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Keith Smith
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- Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 8:38 pm
- Location: Pompton Plains, NJ
- Contact:
Re: I-11 Hold at PDZ Problem - help
Matt,
That explains it
Ironically, Real World IFR has a refresher section, specifically on holding and deals with EXACTLY what you just described. The error is usually in transcribing and visualizing the hold rather than in knowing how to enter a depicted hold. The material gives a bunch of different holding instructions and goes through the process of interpreting them, drawing them on a map, etc.
That explains it
Ironically, Real World IFR has a refresher section, specifically on holding and deals with EXACTLY what you just described. The error is usually in transcribing and visualizing the hold rather than in knowing how to enter a depicted hold. The material gives a bunch of different holding instructions and goes through the process of interpreting them, drawing them on a map, etc.