Pilot Tools

Kevin_atc
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Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 7:01 pm

Pilot Tools

Post by Kevin_atc »

I think that once things get going, it would be neat to have a "Pilot Lounge" sort of feature available to all pilots who are a part of the network. The "Lounge" would be available to any active pilot after they log into their account on the website and things within the lounge would consist of anything they may need during pre-flight or during their flight such as charts, TEC routes, weather doppler/briefings, TFRs, virtual log book, stuff from skyvector.com, etc... I think we could make this look really cool and have it be a very useful tool for our online pilots.
Kevin
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Dan Everette
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Dan Everette »

Was thinking the same thing during my run this afternoon, but with a different spin. Rather than create another thread...

Along the lines of "Pilot Tools", I'd recommend an "Instructor Resources" section. During the time I taught instrument, I had about a dozen or so "lesson plans" that were nothing more than specific IFR round-robin plans with a specific airport/approach sequence. It was mainly for IPC and currency folks (and the instrument students looking and capable of a challenge).

I bring this up in that the vast majority of the user base are not going to be intimately familiar with SoCal/NorCal airspace. As a huge element of the user base (and a big source of word-of-mouth advertising) for PE will be instructors/flight schools, it might be prudent to have some "lesson plans" or pre-created IFR packages/round-robins tailored specifically to the airspace. Perhaps even with footnotes for the CFII with "you can expect a turn to xxxx and a climb to xxxx" at this point.... Sort of a primer on how to best utilize PE to maximize the efficiency of the sim.

I'll put together an example, but I do not know the airspace at all, so it might be laughable.
_________________________________________
-Dan Everette
Having the runway in sight just at TDZE + 100 is like Mom, Warm cookies and milk, and Christmas morning, all wrapped into one.
Kevin_atc
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Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 7:01 pm

Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Kevin_atc »

Dan,

I think what you're talking about is something Keith has done already with the ZLA Pilot Certs. Check out this webpage: http://pilotcerts.laartcc.org/page/ratings.html
Obviously we could make new ones that would also be a bit more challenging (however the last 2 ratings, I-10 and I-11 that you cannot see on that webpage, are quite challenging) but if you click on those ratings, you'll see that Keith did a very good job IMO of briefing the pilots on what to expect on the flight. Is that the kind of thing you're talking about?
Kevin
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Dan Everette
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Dan Everette »

Kevin,

Sort of, but not quite. What I'm talking about is geared specifically for the instructor. What KS has would be a good starting point, but there needs to be.....different.... information.

The idea is to provide information for CFII's, who are completely unfamiliar with the airspace, that they can formulate some lesson plans (or steal some from an instructor resources section) for their students.

If I'm an instructor on the east coast, and learn about PE, I'd immediately see the value as a training tool, as any semi-competent CFII would (not saying I'm even remotely so). The value I see is two-fold. I can recommend they buy a PC and practice at home (which we all know is great for learning/honing procedures), but I see the greater value as an add-on to the sim at my flight school. PE would be an added element of immersion that just puts you over the edge as far as training a student goes. As a CFII, I want to maximize that immersion in the limited amount of sim time I have with the student. Keeping in mind that they're paying /hour for the sim, and the CFII.

Not being familiar with the airspace, I could spend 20-30 hours studying charts, procedures, and airspace then come up with my own round-robins/lesson-plans. Or could use some pre-made ones (as a starting point), as well as notes on the procedures/airspace that are tailored to the instructor, so that I can work them into sim lessons for various levels of students. I'd imagine something like 10 different round-robin flights. 5 one hour recommendations, and 5 two hour recommendations. The 5 recommendations would scale in difficulty (or rather workload) from first time IFR student to ATP.

Having a Pilot Section would obviously be extremely handy, but I'm talking about content that would make it easier to sell to your CFII's that have no experience in the NorCal/SoCal airspace.

Just an idea.
_________________________________________
-Dan Everette
Having the runway in sight just at TDZE + 100 is like Mom, Warm cookies and milk, and Christmas morning, all wrapped into one.
Keith Smith
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Keith Smith »

Fascinating idea, Dan. Anything I can do to bring CFII's into the fold, and then recommend it to their students, is time well-spent.

A lot of pilots might be using this for self-study, too (such as the IMCClub pilots). Perhaps the rides would be available there as well, with descriptions of why each of the rides has been recommended and a subset of the information which is made available to the CFII's in their lesson plans. That way, everyone gets the benefit, even if they're not coming here as a result of a referral from a CFII.

Another idea would be to take it to the next level with regularly scheduled events that focus on those rides. That way, pilots will be an environment with other pilots doing much the same thing, and deal with the complexity that comes from doing that.

Enroute holds as a result of one-in, one-out would be an excellent situation for pilots to encounter, and then potentially modify their plans (divert if the wait is too long) accordingly. We can talk about this in detail when we meet, Dan, or we can talk about it here. I'm very interested, regardless of whether it's done as presented, or taken all the way up to being the basis of regularly scheduled events.
Alex Stjepanovic
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Alex Stjepanovic »

I have nothing specific to contribute to this, but I love the idea of "events". It's not someting you get much of on VATSIM.
Keith Smith
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Keith Smith »

Events in general are going to be HUGE here. We'll probably start doing them pretty regularly during the beta in an attempt to shape the traffic to give everyone the best experience that we can with a small number of concurrent users.

Kevin, we discussed this on the scope just now, but I wanted to get this in the forum, too....I'm not opposed to a pilot lounge, but given the r/w audience that will be flying here, I am not sure how many people will use it. Most pilots have got an online ritual for charts, plates, weather, flight planning, etc. I'm concerned that it will take a lot of resources to build a great lounge, only to have it be under-utilized by our audience. For example, vatsim zla site has some excellent weather and chart systems....and I never, ever use them as a pilot, only because I already have what I need elsewhere, and I suspect others are in the same boat.
Dan Everette
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Dan Everette »

Keith,

Sounds good. I can probably say what I'm thinking about better than I can type... Will wait till we meet.

However, I would recommend some consideration to a basic pilot resource center. Not to the level of the VATSIM ZLA one, but something that has the basics. For instance, when I used to recommend VATSIM to students, I would say "Fly like you normally would, and if nobody is online/or it gets too easy, head over to SoCal". Granted I was a bit biased towards ZBW at the time (not because I was controlling on VATSIM here, but that's the airspace the pilot's were flying). A big majority of the questions I would get were "well, I don't have charts", or "I'm not really familiar with the area". Keep in mind this wasn't your typical VATSIM pilot, but an instrument student who had bought his NACO/JEPP's for the local area, and hadn't gotten to the point where he knew what resources were out there (he's still a student). I'd say something with very basic information.

EVENTS: Freaking phenomenal! I can think of at least half-a-dozen ways off the top of my head to incorporate an event on PE into IFR training that was previously unavailable. For instance: Imagine being a CFII at some school/field in East Podunk, Maine (obligatory: Ya can't get there from here). During your IFR training, the busiest you ever saw it was the other airplane on the ground at the Class D you flew to as part of your long cross-country. Having a tool like PE, during an event with increased (read increased being approaching real world traffic levels) traffic that you can inject, and more importantly INTERACT with, in a sim, is a Godsend. Well help assuage that nagging feeling in the back of a competent CFII's mind of "have I given him/her the exposure/tools to successfully negotiate what the 'system' can throw at them"?

On a side note, I'm assuming (incorrectly perhaps?) that the PE client will work without invalidating the FAA approved version to XP? If it doesn't invalidate it, I would honestly say that PE would be the coolest thing to happen to GA IFR training since the advent of the simulator for GA use.

Sorry to ramble. Just see so many ways that PE can be used to increase training proficiency, and make your average instrument pilot/student safer in the air. We'll talk when we meet.

Cheers,
_________________________________________
-Dan Everette
Having the runway in sight just at TDZE + 100 is like Mom, Warm cookies and milk, and Christmas morning, all wrapped into one.
David Carman
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Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:09 pm

Re: Pilot Tools

Post by David Carman »

On a side note, I'm assuming (incorrectly perhaps?) that the PE client will work without invalidating the FAA approved version to XP? If it doesn't invalidate it, I would honestly say that PE would be the coolest thing to happen to GA IFR training since the advent of the simulator for GA use.
This is a question I was wondering about at The Summit and didn't get an answer to. Keith, do you know?
Keith Smith
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Re: Pilot Tools

Post by Keith Smith »

When I proposed PE to Precision Flight Controls months ago (makers of FTD's and ATD's that are FAA-approved for all sorts of tasks, and run on xplane), I asked them the same thing. They said that they had some discretion as to when it needed to be reevaluated by the FAA...and that they didn't think this would warrant a recert.

This will be in front of the eyes of some FAA people at some point, we'll see what they say. The plugin really does very little other than draw what may as well be some simple buildings...so hopefully it won't cause a problem.
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