V2 rating

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curtis008
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:15 pm

V2 rating

Post by curtis008 »

Recently I flew the V2 test, With X-Plane using a Mac. After studying for the test. I signed on and asked to take V2 test. cleared to taxied to runway 19R and was cleared for take off. Things were good until the controller mention the turn right to a heading of 330 and resume own navigation.
I was asked to avoid the approach end of 19R.at that point I had a brain cramp, there is no moving map gps to watch for airspace violations. if you have X-Plane on a Mac you have to fly VOR to VOR with time and distance. so how does a Mac pilot get around this situation.
I checked Reality GPS runs on a Windows OS with X-Plane and the other sources are FMC's. How does one do this in the real world with out a GPS? If I sign in with my ICAO there is no location to tell ATC I do not have a GPS /A type

A controller for KONT had an Idea for a left turn to the El Toro VOR, and then priced on course, which made allot of sense afterwords.
I am wondering if there should be a thread for no GPS FMC types to have alternate ideas to fly the ratings tests.

Thanks for your input.

N212CW Curtis
Brandon Grchan
Posts: 572
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 4:51 am
Location: Florida

Re: V2 rating

Post by Brandon Grchan »

curtis008 wrote:Recently I flew the V2 test, With X-Plane using a Mac. After studying for the test. I signed on and asked to take V2 test. cleared to taxied to runway 19R and was cleared for take off. Things were good until the controller mention the turn right to a heading of 330 and resume own navigation.
I was asked to avoid the approach end of 19R.at that point I had a brain cramp, there is no moving map gps to watch for airspace violations. if you have X-Plane on a Mac you have to fly VOR to VOR with time and distance. so how does a Mac pilot get around this situation.
I checked Reality GPS runs on a Windows OS with X-Plane and the other sources are FMC's. How does one do this in the real world with out a GPS? If I sign in with my ICAO there is no location to tell ATC I do not have a GPS /A type

A controller for KONT had an Idea for a left turn to the El Toro VOR, and then priced on course, which made allot of sense afterwords.
I am wondering if there should be a thread for no GPS FMC types to have alternate ideas to fly the ratings tests.

Thanks for your input.

N212CW Curtis
I'm a little confused by what you mean here. First I dont see how you would need a GPS to avoid an approach end of a runway especially if your flying VFR. Second, and even weirder to me, is that you would be cleared for takeoff and then told to avoid the approach end of 19R seeing as how you are already on it... Perhaps the controller told you to avoid the extended center line of the 19R approach course? Either way the suggested path of the V2 flight keeps you clear of this area.
Brandon Grchan
PilotEdge Air Traffic Controller
Andrew Doubleday
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Location: Grand Forks, ND

Re: V2 rating

Post by Andrew Doubleday »

Curtis,


Typical VFR departure instructions from John Wayne are based upon your destination airport or requested direction of flight and generally involve a heading and initial altitude instructions which ensure separation from IFR traffic landing/departing the field. The Orange departure (330 heading, advertised for northwest/northeastbound departures) or the El Toro departure (heading 080, advertised for southeast/northeast departures) would both technically work heading up towards ONT.

I'm guessing that on departure, you were assigned the 330 heading, radar identified by the tower, then told some point shortly thereafter to proceed on course, altitude your discretion and to remain west of the extended 19 centerlines at John Wayne for arrival traffic or something like that... Is that accurate at all?

Either way, you should be able to navigate to a visual reference point on the sectional that will keep you out of that final area and navigate relatively easy up towards ONT from there. I'd probably recommend proceeding northbound towards Anaheim Stadium or something, then possibly track V394 north eastbound towards Paradise (PDZ) over the Chino Foothills, then start looking for Chino and Ontario airports to visually navigate via, that would keep you rather clear of the 19s at SNA. If you decided to head eastbound on departure towards El Toro, probably navigate out towards the old base or the VOR, then turn northbound towards Ivine Lake and navigate over the Foothills towards Chino... This would also work pretty well.

Really the key is though to navigate via pilotage as much as practical (realizing some sims are not entirely accurate in simulating some of the VFR reference points found on a sectional, but the key points should be there, such as lakes, major terrain and major landmarks.) You can use VOR to VOR, try to find some VFR airways or VOR radials that would allow you to navigate from those VFR points on the sectional towards the next area that you need to proceed towards if you're not certain where you are in relation to other airspace.

SoCal can be a bit tricky with the close proximity of airports and terrain being a major limiting factor. A good combination or both pilotage and VOR navigation should work well to keep you out of trouble when navigating the airspace here.


Regards,
Andrew James Doubleday | aj@pilotedge.net
PilotEdge ATCS | University of North Dakota FAA CTI

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Andrew Doubleday
Posts: 674
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 8:37 pm
Location: Grand Forks, ND

Re: V2 rating

Post by Andrew Doubleday »

Curtis,


I've made a visual to help describe what I'm talking about above as well, very well could have been arrival traffic that the controller wanted to keep you clear of. The two routes I've suggested as well should work if you can manage to navigate that either via pilotage, VOR radials, or a combination of both.

Hope this helps.

Image


Regards,
Andrew James Doubleday | aj@pilotedge.net
PilotEdge ATCS | University of North Dakota FAA CTI

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curtis008
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:15 pm

Re: V2 rating

Post by curtis008 »

Andrew :
I'm guessing that on departure, you were assigned the 330 heading, radar identified by the tower, then told some point shortly thereafter to proceed on course, altitude your discretion and to remain west of the extended 19 centerlines at John Wayne for arrival traffic or something like that... Is that accurate at all?
You are correct, I have re flown this route offline to take another look at the pilotage VFR. I was able to follow the river (under the orange line) which does the pilotage thing very well. I think I may have been flying to long dependent on electronic navigation in a flight sim, without ATC. A good learning experience for me.
Last edited by curtis008 on Mon Oct 31, 2011 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Keith Smith
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Re: V2 rating

Post by Keith Smith »

From the V2 text itself:
One way to get to the destination would be to head towards the Paradise VOR (112.20), keeping the rising terrain off to the right side.

As you pass the hill off your right side, approximately 14 miles prior to Paradise VOR, turn to the north (heading 360). This should take you over Chino airport, and set you up for a downwind or base entry for Ontario. Enter the pattern as instructed by ATC, most likely a left downwind entry for rwy 26L or 26R.
From memory, I think the rating's video also describes a suggested procedure for flying it.

The ratings were all designed with the /U or /A pilot in mind.
Steven Winslow
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Re: V2 rating

Post by Steven Winslow »

If you're looking for a plugin or an add on to make your flight a little easier on your Mac, you should download XHSI from the link below:

http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?app ... file=12762

I use XHSI to see where the waypoints and VOR's are located. It is a handy plugin, indeed.

If you have an iPad, iPod or iPhone, you can also buy a great app called AirTrack. It is similar to XHSI and works great for assisting with navigational procedures.

But you really shouldn't need those things for V-1 and V-2. V-3 is a little trickier and it's nice to have a visual reference for the waypoints.

The videos for all the ratings are great learning tools and if you have not watched them before flying the test, I strongly suggest that be part of your preparation. I probably watched each video 4 or 5 times each before doing the flight.
Steven Winslow
CEO/Owner - Air Northwest Virtual Airlines • http://www.airnorthwest.org
People should get what they want when they want it once in a while. Keeps them optimisitic.
DrZGard
Posts: 52
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 9:07 pm
Location: Beaverton, OR, USA

Re: V2 rating

Post by DrZGard »

The iPad/iPhone program SkyCharts is a really good bargain. While it is designed for real world flight the developer linked it to xPlane so it will act as a moving map depicting your position just as the GPS will do in real flight. It is also considerably less expensive than ForeFlight. SkyCharts does include the flyway maps which are helpful flying VFR through the corridors. Unless ForeFlight, WingX, Jepp FD, etc decide to recognize this technology this is the only way to emulate the iPad use of chart technology in the cockpit with a real world aviation app. There are sim based apps but SkyCharts is a real world aviation app, includes sectionals, lo and hi enroute, TAC and flyway charts for the entire USA and approach plates.
Regards,
Dr. Zane Gard
ASEL IFR

AOPA #00915027
EAA #825848
American Mensa #100314888
curtis008
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:15 pm

Re: V2 rating

Post by curtis008 »

Brandon Grchan: When I made the turn to a heading of 330 and the controller said, "avoid the extended center line of the 19R approach course". Thinking back, my issue was that my next waypoint was on the other side of the extended centerline. and I was unable to resolve a VOR issue before almost flying into the Los Alamitos airspace. I did not dawn on me that i could have flown a heading of 350 and regrouped.

Keith Smith: thanks for the link, I was not aware the videos were on the website.

Steven Winslow:thanks for this link, it looks like it will be nice app for the moving map feature.

DrZGard:thank you for this information.

Pilot Edge is turning out to be a very good learning experience for me
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