[Jan 11, Sat 7:45pm PST] KAVX-KONT then KONT-KSBA (IFR)

[Cyrus]

Note: there have been quite a few edits to this post. As of 12:00pm PST on Jan. 8th, 2014, I have incorporated all of the suggestions into the top post. We will keep the history below for learning purposes and for any ongoing discussions, but please refer to *this* post (at the top of the thread) for the latest details of the Fly Out. Thanks.

"Double Trouble"

Hi. Me again. I just couldn't resist proposing another Fly-Out (also as I'll be out of town next week, and suffering withdrawal symptoms)....

Two flights for the price of one this time. Feel free to join either one or, preferably, both. I figured that it will be fun to see and interact with all the traffic coming into and going out of ONT. Plenty of ATC interaction with many frequency changes guaranteed! It's two separate IFR flights, and the whole affair should last just a tad over two hours (if you do both flights).

Note: all times in PST, i.e. GMT-8 / EST-3):

Flight 1: KAVX to KONT
Depart: Saturday January 11th at 8:15pm (+/- 10 minutes for taxi/takeoff sequencing) and arrive around 8:45pm.
Route to File: “SLI V8 PDZ” at 5,000ft (aka TEC Route "CSTN49") at 140 KTAS (or whatever you think you can handle).
Skyvector link here.
MyFlightRoute link here.

Flight 2: KONT to KSBA
Depart: Saturday January 11th at ~9:05pm (+/- 10 minutes for taxi/takeoff sequencing) and arrive around 10:05pm.
Route to File: “PDZ V186 DEANO V27 KWANG” at 6,000ft (aka TEC Route "ONTN16") at 140 KTAS (or whatever you think you can handle).
Skyvector link here.
MyFlightRoute link here.

DETAILED SCHEDULE:

• Optional but recommended: Log on to a PE chat session, preferably using your first name and callsign, e.g. "Cyrus_258E". Also, if you want casual chit chat over voice, you can monitor 123.45 (prior to announcing intentions on CTAF).
• Between 7:45pm and 8:00pm – Be on the ramp at Catalina (non-Towered), monitoring CTAF. If you want to file your flightplan and pickup your clearance while on the ground, then aim to call SOCAL DEPARTURE on 127.4 between 7:55pm and 8:00pm*. [EDIT: See Keith Smith's note below about recommended ways to pick up your Clearance to KONT]
• Between 8:05pm and 8:15pm - If you plan to depart VFR and pick up your Clearance in the air, then announce your intentions on the CTAF and make your way to the runway.
• Between 8:10pm and 8:15pm – If you're departing IFR, switch back to CTAF, announce your movements as you make your way to the runway hold short line.
• Aim to depart as close to 8:15PM as you can (or as traffic/ATC will allow).
• Enroute - Once airborne, manage your speed to keep from getting too far ahead or too far behind (while following any required ATC instructions for separation, of course).
• Between 8:40pm and 8:50pm - Land at KONT and taxi to parking (or be already parked on the ramp, if you didn't do the first flight). Cool off, take a quick bio-break, then get back in the saddle and prepare for the next flight.
• Between 8:50pm and 9:00pm - File the next flight and call up CD on 118.1 for your Clearance to KSBA.
• Around 9:00pm - Request taxi from Ground… and get going.
• Aim to depart as close to 9:05PM as you can (or as traffic/ATC will allow).
• Around 10:00pm - Land, taxi, park, shutdown. Champagne celebration in the IRC Chat room. Assuming that you didn't get held up at Ontario, you should have just enough time to catch the limo that will be waiting for you outside the Santa Barbara terminal, to take you to James Franco's Malibu beach house party....

* Note: If departing Catalina IFR, keep in mind Clearance "void" times and when to switch back and forth between CTAF and SoCal, per this and this.

AIRCRAFT/EQUIPMENT/SPEED:
Any aircraft capable of cruising at a reasonable speed (e.g. 130 KIAS) at 6,000ft. Also, you'll need VOR + DME equipment, i.e. /A (unless you're a total masochist).
[EDIT: See Keith's note below about speed]

I’m sorry if the date/time doesn’t work for you (but remember, you can always schedule your own Fly-Out on this forum, and I’m sure there will be others in your time zone or at the time you want to fly that will appreciate it).

I do hope to see as many of you as possible this Saturday at around 7:45pm Pacific Time.

Finally, if anything needs to be corrected here, please don't hesitate to chime in (history shows that people aren't shy ).

Cheers,
Cyrus

[Keith Smith]

I will see if I can suspend the AVX fixed wing drones during this operation (no promises). That's a bit of a drone hub. The helicopters aren't a problem as they don't use the runway, but there's several Pipers, Mooney's, Beeches and at least one Learjet that operate there regularly, often in opposite directions.

Also know that you won't be launched in quick succession since it's a non-towered field. The preceding aircraft will have to be radar identified prior to another aircraft being released there. There are 3 options for departing:
1) pick up your clearance and an IFR release on the ground (time consuming if an aircraft has already been released ahead of you)
2) pick up your clearance on the ground but depart VFR and activate in the air (ATC knows you're coming). Recommended if weather permits.
3) pick up your clearance in the air by cold calling Socal. This shouldn't be too time consuming since it's a TEC route.

Note: while you can pick up TEC without filing, it's faster if you do file. Given the number of planes that might be attending, you'll get faster service if you do file.

Thanks for organizing, Cyrus. If you're going to be IFR, ATC will manage the speeds so I wouldn't sweat it too much beyond setting an initial target. If faster airplanes show up later, it's not a problem, you'll all still arrive at about the same time. It was actually neat having the Corvalis and Jetstream flying higher and faster than the other traffic during the last flyout.

[Cyrus]

Thanks for the support, Keith.

Regarding the drones at AVX, part of me hopes that you do ground at least some of those trigger-happy bad boys. But another part of me thinks it could be extra fun and challenging with them all buzzing in and out. However, since they wouldn't be announcing on CTAF, we might have quite a job on our hands if we all head out at a similar time.

As for the initial clearance to KONT, I like your options 2 and 3, and will probably go for one of those.

[Keith Smith]

Cyrus, one last note. Your message advised people to manage their speed enroute to not get too far ahead of the pack. Just a reminder, the rules governing enroute speed on an IFR flight are fairly specific. You need to maintain the TAS that you file in your flight plan within 10kts or 5%, or at the very least, advise ATC if you're changing your speed. If people are constantly changing their speeds without ATC involvement it can become tricky.

More importantly, there's going to be a lot of temptation to 'chat' on the CTAF (it's a real problem in real life, too). I'd recommend encouraging pilots to meet on 123.45 or 122.75 or the IRC room for pre-flight discussion. The CTAF should be reserved for recommended position reports and pattern coordination, that's about it. I'll try to remember to have a recorder going for the CTAF for the event, too Hopefully it won't be filled with, "so, what route are we taking?" transmissions.

[Cyrus]

Multiple edits made to the OP - based on the comments/feedback above.

[matt]

I will try and attend both this time.

[Cyrus]

That's great, Matt. On the last one (Yuma to SNA), you said...

...I joined in late, so I picked up flight following from Santa Monica to John Wayne, but I still had a blast.

So can we assume that you'll be flying from Honolulu this time, perhaps picking up your Clearance to Ontario somewhere over Catalina at FL350?

[sronayne96]

Would love to as usual but can't because of the 4am time GMT. These events look really well organised Cyrus and look like great fun as well. So fair play for organising them. I completely understand the evening time as most PE users are American and the evening suits better for obvious reasons. However if there ever was any plans for a "euro friendly" event in terms of time, I would certainly be in. Have fun on Saturday!

Seán

[Cyrus]

Sean, seriously... you should post one for your part of the world. It doesn't need to be as ridiculously elaborate/confusing as mine (which is probably a consequence of my inexperience and lack of confidence!). If you do, you might just capture the attention of everyone east of Greenland

Anyway, thanks for the good wishes

[Keith Smith]

Sean...stop waiting and start posting. I'm sure there are other European/Aussie pilots who would love to join you.