ATC interaction question

[arb65912]

I was browsing through the Q and A on AOPA safety Institute site and I would like someone to explain in a bit more for me.

Q: If I need to call Flight Service, when is the best time to request a frequency change?
A: Just after a hand–off to the next sector controller.
My question: What would be the situation when I would need to call Flight Service while talking to the controller?
If I wanted to cancel my IFR Flight Plan , I would do it while still with the Controller or right after landing.

Q: How does ATC utilize Guard Channel [121.5 mhz] and how would I receive these communications?
A: ATC uses guard frequencies when an aircraft does not answer on normal frequencies, or when an aircraft calls the controller on the guard frequency. Once communications are established, the aircraft is normally assigned another frequency.
My question: when would a pilot call Controller on guard frequency?
I thought, in case of lost comm, I would try to call last Controller I was talking to or try closest facility...

Cheers, AJ

[Keith Smith]

Flight service is for more than canceling flight plans. You could check notams, check weather, or file a flight plan with them.

Edit: you might also want to call FSS to OPEN a VFR flight plan that is already on file.

Guard (121.50) can be used by ATC to hail an aircraft (all aircraft are supposed to monitor guard when able), or it can be used by an aircraft in distress to reach ATC (most facilities monitor guard).

If you are already in communication with ATC on the radio, there is no need to call them on guard in case of an emergency.

[arb65912]

Thank you, Keith.
I understand what you explained but I was wondering if the pilot is already flying and in contact with ATC, when would he want to call Flight Service.

He should be already familiar with all you mentioned, Notams, weather and flight plan filled.

Unless you are talking about cases when the new Notams were issued during the flight, weather brief was needed again just in case to make sure all if fine and maybe file a new flight plan due to various circumstances.
I believe that this is the case you meant in your description.

Sorry for dragging the subject on.

Cheers, AJ

[Kyle Rodgers]

AJ, keep in mind that not everyone talking to ATC is IFR. When you file a VFR flight plan, ATC never sees it. I'm not sure how much real world flight experience you have, but if you've ever filed a VFR flight plan and then called up a facility for flight following, you'll note they ask you where you're headed and for your aircraft type. Some pilots scratch their head at that: *I filed a flight plan. Shouldn't they know already???*

VFR flight plans remain at the FSS and are tracked based on time alone. If you file the plan and open it, they're expecting you to arrive at your destination at the time you told them. If you expect you're behind on your times, you'd have to update them using any FSS freq. If you're flying VFR on a VFR flight plan, and you're talking to ATC for FF, that's a time where you'd have to jump off of an ATC freq to address things with FSS on their freq.

Other cases would be ones you mention. The one I'd argue you'd see more often is questions about weather updates (or you could just tune a VOR with a HIWAS broadcast, and avoid the freq switch issue because you'd be receiving on the NAV).

[Keith Smith]

AJ,

If you need to divert to another field, you might want to obtain a briefing for the new airport. I'm avoiding the topic of simply getting updated weather for your arrival field (which is a very common operation if you don't have onboard weather capability), because that is done with Enroute Flight Advisory Service (Flight Watch).

Also, you're missing the point that the pilot might want to FILE a flight plan. That's not something which ATC can always accommodate. In some circumstances, they will ask you to contact Flight Service to take care of that. For example, you depart from airport A, heading to airport B, the forecast is for reasonably good weather. Midway through the flight, you talk to Flight Watch to get updated weather....there's now a 1000ft ceiling at the destination airport. The bad weather arrived sooner than expected. So, you go back to ATC and ask to pick up IFR to the destination. For any number of reasons, ATC might say, "unable, contact Flight Service with your request." So, off you go to Flight Service to file an IFR flight plan while you're in the air.

[Keith Smith]

Kyle, most pilots on PilotEdge are aware that VFR flight plans are not seen by ATC ever since we introduced that feature on the server

[arb65912]

Kyle and Keith, thank you very much. It sure helped me understand the case.
Yes, I did know about VFR plans being not seen by ATC.

[Kyle Rodgers]

Kyle, most pilots on PilotEdge are aware that VFR flight plans are not seen by ATC ever since we introduced that feature on the server

True. I'm still training my brain out of the VATSIM ways of thought in some ways. Good point.

Really good point on the pop-up IFR bit, too. I actually never thought about that.

[Orest Skrypuch]

Kyle, most pilots on PilotEdge are aware that VFR flight plans are not seen by ATC ever since we introduced that feature on the server

This one wasn't, good feature!

* Orest

[arb65912]

I disagree, Orest. This feature is kind of equivalent of VFR flight plan, it is not seen by ATC but let you track your flights on PEaware. I have spent quite a few hours flying VFR on PE and if the strip was not created by Controller for me , all these flight were never recorded.
I think it is an excellent feature but I respect your opinion.
Cheers, AJ