Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby RogerW » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:07 am

FDXDave wrote:Part 2. The biggest problem i see there was you said you saw the danger and then requested vectors.
You are aloud to do what ever you need to do ...

Dave


This might come off the wrong way but we are all here to learn, even if it is other than aviation ...

Although 'aloud' is a word, the proper spelling of the word you wanted to use is 'allowed'.

Blue skies! :D
Roger W.
Home: Valkaria, Fl (X59)(but lost in SoCal)
PE Rating: CAT-11, I-2
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby FDXDave » Tue Apr 16, 2019 8:39 am

RogerW wrote:
FDXDave wrote:Part 2. The biggest problem i see there was you said you saw the danger and then requested vectors.
You are aloud to do what ever you need to do ...

Dave


This might come off the wrong way but we are all here to learn, even if it is other than aviation ...

Although 'aloud' is a word, the proper spelling of the word you wanted to use is 'allowed'.

Blue skies! :D


There are reasons i never entered a Spelling bee. Ha
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby Nole_Cal_Kev » Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:34 pm

New PE user here. I just got back into Flight Simulation this month after giving up on FSX years ago. I made the switch to X Plane 11 and am loving it. It runs so much better on my above average but dated gaming system than FSX ever did with eye candy installed. I love simulation games that allow interaction with other real people and PE was the logical choice for a challenge.

Anyhow, was flying VFR around ZLA for some missions and decided to land at Santa Maria in prep for my CAT-05 rating I would attempt later. I called into Twr 10mi North of airport level at 2500ft and was given instruction to report at 3mi right base rwy 30. I acknowledged the instruction but totally failed to register the procedure. Instead I descended to pattern altitude and entered right downwind 30 with plans to maintain downwind heading 3 miles past the airport then turn on to right base. Tower kindly explained my mistake and how problematic (dangerous) it would be IRL but cleared me to land rwy 30 (thankfully there were no other arrivals at the time).

After landing and taxing to parking I wanted to chat with ATC about the correct procedure. After sitting at the ramp for a few minutes I thought about it and it makes total sense not to just join a pattern and I now feel much more prepared to receive and follow an instruction that isn't to enter the pattern immediately.

Embarrassed? Yes. Discouraged from flying tonight? Nope.
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby Ebfd86 » Thu May 16, 2019 10:29 pm

Not sure if this was all on me but. I had some issues in my last flight that caused a snowball effect which turned a flight that started flawless and uneventful to crap real quicK. In the real world I’m a basic private. It was my first chance to get on here in a while so I used custom weather to be able to make the flight VFR. When filing the flight plan it prompted me to advise the controller I had Zulu. I took this for meaning that Information Zulu was to let Controllers know i was using custom weather. Departure was a breeze no issues there. I was flying into a class C airport when I called approach on the frequency listed for Monterey class c. I was told to contact a different frequency switched and called again and i gave the information Zulu thinking that’s what I was supposed to because of the message from the flight planner. I was advised to get the current atis which wasn’t a big deal but. When i tuned in the atis frequency it started to give me default XP atis than would cut out and go silent. So i had to find it elsewhere online which on top of making an extra frequency change caused me to get behind the aircraft a little. I initially planned to cruise at 6,500 but went up to 8,500 due to the terrain. I’ve never been to Monterey before night started to fall and i was late starting the decent after being higher than i would have liked with everything going on. These events led to a lousy approach which I had to preform a go around but when looking into the airport i didn’t see anything on the noise abatement. The controller was talking fast which I know they have to sometimes but I wasn’t catching my call sign to well. I thought he said to make right traffic but that pointed me into mountain so i started making all kinds of turns looking like a fool to not crash but still try and follow what i thought I heard but of course that wasn’t what i heard so you know how that goes. Than at that point I was just ready to give up and quit but i wanted to complete the flight after making the 100 nm journey so I just took my lashing and landed the plane. Of course I had to miss one more radio call while prematurely switching to ground. It’s just amazing how the smallest of things can snowball into disaster. I’m embarrassed to try and depart out of there to make the return trip tomorrow : /
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby Keith Smith » Fri May 17, 2019 7:48 am

Advising the controller that you had info Zulu should have been sufficient. You should not have been advised to report with the current ATIS if you stated that you had information Zulu (custom weather). In this case, I would simply state again, "We do have information ZULU." Make sure you say it clearly and that the controller hears it.

Note: filing the flight plan with the custom weather option will actively suppress the reception of the PE ATIS (that is the point of the option). That's why you weren't able to hear the PE ATIS.

Right traffic is correct for 28L/R at MRY as there is terrain on the south side of the airport. Right traffic would have kept you on the north side of the airport.

If you were unsure about the pattern entry, the best course of action would be to speak up and say something. Executing a set of random turns within the airport traffic area is not a good idea as makes it impossible for the controller to sequence traffic at the airport.

Don't be embarrassed. Identify the issues which were yours and strive to improve on the next flight.
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby jjuhl » Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:12 am

First day, second flight on PE, CAT-2. Called KSPB tower on what I later realized was Santa Barbara approach frequency. The controller directed me to contact KSPB tower on the correct frequency.

Several mistakes here:
- intending to contact approach but saying “San Luis tower” (blindly following the cat-2 instructions’ “script”)
- assuming the approach frequency in FF was for San Luis when it was Santa Barbara (Inadequate briefing)

When VFR, how do I know who to contact first, approach or tower?

My home airport is KFSD, class D, and I always contact approach first but it’s KFSD approach, not another airport. I asked the google and it seems there’s no clear distinction other than “it depends”
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby kevin meyers » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:42 am

jjuhl wrote:
When VFR, how do I know who to contact first, approach or tower?

My home airport is KFSD, class D, and I always contact approach first but it’s KFSD approach, not another airport. I asked the google and it seems there’s no clear distinction other than “it depends”


It all comes down to the type of airspace around the airport. Why is it that you always call approach heading into FSD? Do you feel as though you have to?

SBP is also a class D with no surrounding C or B airspace that you need to traverse to get there. Therefore, your only requirements for the radios are establishing 2-way radio communications with SBP Tower prior to entering the class D airspace. Approach never needs to know anything about you.

The AFD or even just the frequency area of airnav.com is a good source to find the name of the approach control as it will have it listed with the approach/departure frequency.
Kevin
Retired PilotEdge Air Traffic Controller / Instructor
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby jjuhl » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:41 pm

kevin meyers wrote:
It all comes down to the type of airspace around the airport. Why is it that you always call approach heading into FSD? Do you feel as though you have to?



I just finished my PPL in May out of an uncontrolled airport (Y14) about 10 miles from FSD. My instructors always had me contact approach when inbound for landing at FSD or when maneuvering in the practice area.

Thanks for your reply!
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby kevin meyers » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:16 pm

jjuhl wrote:
kevin meyers wrote:
It all comes down to the type of airspace around the airport. Why is it that you always call approach heading into FSD? Do you feel as though you have to?



I just finished my PPL in May out of an uncontrolled airport (Y14) about 10 miles from FSD. My instructors always had me contact approach when inbound for landing at FSD or when maneuvering in the practice area.

Thanks for your reply!


I guess the point I wanted to get across is to be sure you know that you don’t HAVE to contact approach when you’re inbound to a class D (pending there’s no class C or B surrounding airspace). When flying in heavily congested areas, such as a practice area, it’s definitely a good idea to have ATC watching over you which is probably why your instructor had you doing it. Personally, I would continue doing that if the area is congested, but just know that it’s not required.
Kevin
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Re: Never again on PE - share your mistakes

Postby bbuckley » Thu Jul 04, 2019 1:55 pm

Over 4 years and over 330 hours on PE (and many hours IRL), I finally did it... landed without clearance. I had just finished installing extensive mods to the Phenom 100 that includes new engines, spoilers, wx radar etc, and I was so preoccupied with the airplane that after being cleared for the visual approach, and listening to the same controller voice all the way down to exiting the runway, he advised I was still on approach freq (I need to check the audio to see if he handed me off to tower with the visual clearance, I just can’t recall), and had landed without clearance. Lesson to self, no matter how many hours you have you can get preoccupied and especially when you're doing something very familiar (an approach I've done many times) you are prone to mistakes. Mea Culpa.

Edit: listened to audio, never got handed off to tower (IFR), but doesn’t change the mea culpa.
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