Crosswind landings – running out of rudder Carenado's Mooney

[mcqueen]

Just tested in the Carenado Baron, the rudder authority just isn't there. Spoke with the fellow responsible for porting these models to X-Plane and he's aware of the issue. Unfortunately, they're tweaked the way they are so they are relatively docile (I suspect it's to match the feel of FSX, since xplane is considered to be very sensitive compared to fsx). Unfortunately, the lack of control authority means that the ability to handle a crosswind is compromised.

Thanks for the information, Keith. Good to know. Although a bummer since the Carenado plane models are so realistic in other ways.

Does anyone know if there are there any specific settings X-Plane users can tweak on our end to provide a temporary "fix" for the issue with the Carenado planes? Or is the problem much more complicated than that? I tried messing with the joystick yaw settings, and while I could make it more sensitive to the touch, it didn't do anything for rudder authority.

I might need to consider flying a different general aviation aircraft when I know it's going to be really windy. Anybody have recommendations for planes that simulate crosswind characteristics well?

[Keith Smith]

I just opened the plane in PlaneMaker. The rudder deflection is +/- 9 degs. The stock Baron that ships with X-Plane is +/- 27 degs.

If you'd like to have more authority, you could update the V10 .ACF file for the aircraft, look for these two entries:
P acf/_rudd1_lf 9.0
P acf/_rudd1_rt 9.0

I'll change it to 27 and let you know how it feels.

[Keith Smith]

scratch that, the actual plane is showing -15/+15 deflection of rudder regardless of the xplane setting. Talking to Carenado about it, will get back to you.

[Keith Smith]

Ok, here's what's going on for the Baron (I can't speak to the Mooney, but the concept is similar, I suspect).

The max control deflection is actually being specified in Custom Avionics\logic.lua in these lines:

set(RudLeftRange, 15)
set(RudRightRange, 15)

This is overriding the X-Plane setting (which was 9, not that it matters). I increased this this 20 degs, the result was slightly better.

MUCH more important, though, is the PHASE OUT function in X-Plane. This allows control deflections to be reduced as speeds increase. This is to compensate for consumer hardware which doesn't have control loading so that the planes don't become more and more sensitive as the airspeed increases.

These can be found by editing the ACF file (for V10 aircraft, or just setting it in PlaneMaker):

P acf/_ailn1_v1 120.0
P acf/_ailn1_v2 160.0

P acf/_rudd1_v1 120.0
P acf/_rudd1_v2 180.0

Those are the NEW V1 and V2 speeds (the old V1 speeds were 0 and the V2's were around 120).

What was happening BEFORE (with 0 for the V1 speed) was that with every knot of speed above 0, the control deflections were being reduced, eventually tapering down to 55% of their original throws by 120kts. This is why might be ok on the first part of the takeoff roll, only to have it weather vane later on as you got close to rotation speed.

The new speeds are set up such that you get the intended deflection (10 degs for aileron, 20 for rudder) all the way up to 120kts, then they start tapering down to 55% of the full deflection by the time you reach the V2 speed (160kts for aileron, 180 for rudder).

I tested this with a decent crosswind and it was flyable. I'm probably going to increase the rudder authority even more, but 20 is a good start.

So, those are the variables to play with...the max deflection and the phase out.

[cvenable]

Interesting info, Keith! I'll have to play with that as I have almost every Carenado plane.

A note on max demonstrated crosswind. IMO that is mostly there to protect the manufacturer from getting sued when someone unqualified tries to set her down in a 30-knot crosswind. Max demonstrated is the max that was tested by the manufacturer that was determined by them to be safe. Most planes can handle much stronger winds than the max demonstrated if the pilot is skilled enough to manage them. That's why you see on shows like Flying Wild Alaska pilots landing a C180 in 40-knot crosswinds successfully even though the max demonstrated is probably around 15 knots.

For the record, regardless of the airplane's characteristics on the sim, I still struggle with gusty crosswinds in the teens as a real-world pilot. It's the no. 1 thing I'm working to improve. So don't feel too bad if you're not putting it down on centerline every time even if the plane is perfectly modeled.

[Daddy O]

Out of curiosity, what is the max crosswind component for the RW Carendo?

[Marcus Becker]

Out of curiosity, what is the max crosswind component for the RW Carendo?

RW Carenado? They don't make RW aircraft.