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I think we as pilots can also help the controllers by not talking over one another. I find this to be a common occurrence during periods of high pilot volumes. When you change frequencies, please wait a few seconds before speaking to make sure no one else is already talking or is being talked to. I think that will go a long way in helping out whoever is on duty. I realize that this sometimes happens no matter what, but patience on the airwaves is a good thing, especially when it's busy.

Regards,

Todd

When you fly in the RW, you will get a myriad of controllers with different voices, speeds of delivery and moods.

The PE controllers are superb, and remember that they have to deal with a lot of newcomers, which is what happens (RW) at busy fields with a lot of flight training going on as well. The difference there is that most of the newbies have an instructor sitting next to them, and he/she can quickly put things right. Not like in PE, where you are on your own (unless you are in a training scheme). PE has quite a few members who do not have English as their first language, and that (as in the RW) is another source of tension, which has to be addressed by a busy controller. Also, PE is deliberately operating in one of the most difficult and congested airspace areas in the world! On PE, you will get more airspace busts and other violations than are likely to be happening for real. On PE, a controller's admonition, even if it sometimes comes out as a bit stern (and it's not always so), is the worst you can expect. A bit of embarrassment, perhaps, and a lesson learned. A lot better than a "Please call the Tower on landing" and a possible license suspension, or worse!

The issue of stepping on each other's transmissions is also very relevant, and we have to be especially careful in PE, where one controller may be wearing several hats.

I have absolutely no complaints about any of the controllers, and the differing personalities/moods or whatever mirror what you can expect in the RW. Good days, bad days, workload, etc. - get real, PE customers! This is an educational, practice environment, which can also be entertaining! It is not a game show

Hopefully this doesn't come across wrong but I find it amazing that as a group all of the controllers can hold it together as well as they do. I'm pretty sure I would want to strangle that especially "difficult" someone to deal with from time to time.

I frequently use the PE receiver to monitor PE. IMO the true "acid test" is to listen to ONE guy/gal hold down the fort with 10-20 pilots all asking for clearance at nearly the same time. And to do this while generally remaining in "character" day in and day out to me is just amazing.

Regarding their ability to hold it together when really busy, I'm positive that the stress would have broken me and the results would be like the scene from "The China Syndrome (1979)". The scene where virtually every light/alarm is going off at the same time. While everyone is frozen trying to figure out what to do next. All the while the reactor core is melting down.

Who am I kidding. That scene is repeated in my home sim frequently when I get "behind" the airplane (task saturation). And I have only myself to deal with........

I am most happy with the PE experience and think that the controllers need to be appreciated for a job well done. <virtual hug>.

+1 regarding pilots coming to the party prepared. When possible file your flight plan online. Don't ask a busy controller to create and read a full route clearance because you haven't researched the route ahead of time (to the newbie, we all understand the need to learn. So do the best that you can).

I also listen to LiveATC as well as watch online videos of real world flights. One thing I have noted is when cold calling a RW approach controller with a request, the controller responds with a squawk code and then "say request". Is this a tool that could be used to reduce controller workload during busy times? Is there a reason why it's done sometimes and not others in the real world?

Keep up the good work. Remember to take frequent breaks to avoid burn out. When things get tough take a deep breath (this applies to pilots too).

I could definitely notice over the weekend that the network was very busy. That said the female and male controller who controlled me during my V-3 Rating were very friendly and very professional. I think they could've used the help of an extra controller, but I also know it's hard to predict when that many pilots connect at once.

It's really nice feeling like I'm in a professional training environment with well trained controllers and not having to worry about how long a controller is going to stay on like that other network that is notorious for spotty ATC.

I have to commend the controllers for their professionalism at times. I regularly listen to the PE Receiver and there are some people who just try and fly the complex airliners and really do not know what they are doing. Yes this is a learning network but there is a big difference between someone who is new getting into a C172 at KSNA and joining the pattern and then building up from there learning as they go to someone jumping straight into the airliners. I'm sure at times they would love to say exactly what they think but the calm way they refer people to the PE training program is a credit to the whole team.

wmburns wrote: I also listen to LiveATC as well as watch online videos of real world flights. One thing I have noted is when cold calling a RW approach controller with a request, the controller responds with a squawk code and then "say request". Is this a tool that could be used to reduce controller workload during busy times? Is there a reason why it's done sometimes and not others in the real world?

These sort of calls (versus just making a cold call with your entire request) do reduce my workload.

The cold calls usually require some data entry into the computer (both RW and on PE). Sometimes we are working on something else, and a "with request" sort of instruction gives us time to open the appropriate page. The controller may also be about to issue a longer instruction to a pilot, such as an approach clearance, and having someone else call up with a long request is not ideal. When you do a cold call the controller can become prepared and call you back whenever he/she is ready for the request. I feel it does reduce errors and repeated transmissions: If you just start off with your request and the controller is in the middle of something he will need to ask you again for the information.

RW (and PE) it depends on controller preference and how busy/engaged in the operation the controller is. When it isn't busy the controller is sometimes not fully prepared for the request either.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=4474 is another thread that explains/discusses this.

Jorge Rojas wrote: These sort of calls (versus just making a cold call with your entire request) do reduce my workload.

Noted.....

These sort of calls (versus just making a cold call with your entire request) do reduce my workload.

I want to emphasize Jorge's point that it's controller specific on these types of things. I personally hate "pre-calls" and would rather you make your full request on your first transmission. Most of the time I get everything I need and therefore save a couple of transmissions which saves radio time.

However, both techniques are 100% ok by the book so either way is ok. Don't try to change how you operate to make controllers happy as you won't be able to do so.

I've been staying out of the original purpose of thread as I wanted to see how it developed prior to chiming in.

Thanks for all the positive comments on our controllers, I'll make sure that they get them.

Regarding controller "tone" and corrections. Our controllers are human (obviously) and are subject to having different personalities and mood depending on the day.

I'd avoid trying to over-analyze the tone of a specific controller, obviously you can get a general idea but a lot of factors that may have nothing to do with what's going on on the scope can affect the controllers tone.

With that said we expect all of our controllers to be respectful at all times, that means it's ok if they get a little firm when correcting someone (with some variability depending on the nature of the mistake), but they aren't allowed to cross that line of respect.

If you think a controller has crossed that line please E-mail ops@pilotedge.net or contact me and I'll look into it.

Peter Grey wrote:

These sort of calls (versus just making a cold call with your entire request) do reduce my workload.

I want to emphasize Jorge's point that it's controller specific on these types of things. I personally hate "pre-calls" and would rather you make your full request on your first transmission. Most of the time I get everything I need and therefore save a couple of transmissions which saves radio time.

For the record, the ONLY time I use "pre-calls" is when I'm cold calling an approach controller while air born AND it's busy. Usually looking for flight following after departing a non-towered airport. Or looking for "pop up" IFR after running into IMC while operating VFR.

I think that most of us can agree not to pre-call clearance delivery, ground, or tower.

My question/point regarding the specific example of cold calling approach or center. Especially when things are busy. In my limited understanding of the process:

• They do it in the real world. What are the guide lines when the controller does it (or not)?
• 99% of the time the pilot is cold calling approach/center to make a request that involves a squawk code.
• When I'm in the position to make the long position report on a busy channel it just seems like I'm taking up more than my fair share of radio time. It seems like the controller can prioritize the responses better and the position report goes smoother after the squawk code has already been exchanged.

inquiring minds want to know

They do it in the real world. What are the guide lines when the controller does it (or not)?

There aren't any guidelines, how a controller handles this is 100% controller discretion. Some controllers will issue a squawk right away then get the request, some wait till they have the full request. Personally I like to wait.

99% of the time the pilot is cold calling approach/center to make a request that involves a squawk code.

True.

When I'm in the position to make the long position report on a busy channel it just seems like I'm taking up more than my fair share of radio time. It seems like the controller can prioritize the responses better and the position report goes smoother after the squawk code has already been exchanged.

True, however, an argument can be made that doing a pre-call followed by a full call actually results in an increase of overall radio traffic. However as you mention there are benefits to doing it this way.