PilotEdge Forums

Starting the chant...

NOR-CAL! NOR-CAL! NOR-CAL!

In all seriousness though, this discussion has been a good reminder for me to check the chart and not assume 1000ft AGL for prop planes is the TPA.

par2005 wrote:Ok, I understand the argument about not being able to land in an emergency on the runway - but there are always other places to land in a emergency. A runway, golf field, whatever.

That is a misinformed assertion. Even in the middle of Indiana where I fly, our towered airports are surrounded by relatively congested areas. The #1 spot where I get antsy in the pattern at Lafayette (KLAF) is a left downwind to Runway 23, which goes out over (a) the campus of Purdue University, (b) the Wabash River, and (c) downtown Lafayette. Not one of those offer any reasonably safe place to land, regardless of the presence of golf courses.

Often what makes the difference between surviving an engine emergency is what happens after "landing." The runway at the airport where you're flying the pattern is the best bet, if not for its spaciousness and alignment with the wind, but also because of the availability of emergency equipment that can respond to an accident within 2-3 minutes or less at many airports. While this is just speculation, Harrison Ford may not have survived his plane crash near Santa Monica (SMO) a few days ago had there not been people ready and willing to assist him after the fact. Reports and pictures indicate he had a head injury.

par2005 wrote: But what if you're on base, then on final, and you still can't get through to ATC? You're on the approach, right in the traffic of everyone, and about to land without a clearance?

There was no mention of traffic in the OP's post. Without a landing clearance you must go around. Climb to pattern altitude, turn crosswind at the departure end of the runway, and continue for another round in the pattern.

When ATC has told there is a clearance limit, eg "clearance limit right downwind" I know I am not allowed to turn base without a confirmation. So that's a hard limit. Or is that not used in the US?

What about "report right downwind" - is that a soft limit that can be overridden by the pilot and turned to base, in case the calls don't go through?

When ATC has told there is a clearance limit, eg "clearance limit right downwind" I know I am not allowed to turn base without a confirmation. So that's a hard limit. Or is that not used in the US?

100% not used in the US.

What about "report right downwind" - is that a soft limit that can be overridden by the pilot and turned to base, in case the calls don't go through?

Not a limit at all, simply a report request to help the controller manage the pattern.