PilotEdge Forums

Just had a question about dep/app frequencies in regards to the TAC and sectional. I am new to PE and love it so far. I have been self educating myself on VFR procedures and ATC interactions with the help of PEs training program and the AOPAs online interactive courses(which I HIGHLY recommend). Since I am relatively new to VFR planning,I take a good bit of time to look at the Lax TAC and plot my route and jot down frequencies. This is where I run into issues, the chart can be pretty confusing as to who to contact in the Class C sectors. The bravo is easy as there is only 1 main freq. (134. 9), but the class c is where I trip up in planning. Normally I just request flight following for the frequency hand offs, but would like to be self sufficient in knowing who to contact and what their freq is. I found a Zla cheat sheet on the laartc website, but most freqs don't match the real charts. Anyone have some tips for planning or deciphering the freq list on the charts? I see the freqs and the altitude ranges and what looks like a direction of flight(ie. 300-045). Is there an easier to read map with less clutter depicting the different class c/e zones and who to call? Any tips would be appreciated! Thanks.

Ryan Landis
N119ST

Ryan,

Great question. My impression is that you're making far too much work for yourself. Pre-flight planning is good, but there's simply no operational need to research the likely enroute frequencies that you'll get for the entire flight. It's good to understand what's likely to happen, practically speaking, for a typical XC flight, and then plan accordingly.

Here's how that goes...you'll need the ground and tower frequency for the airport from which you'll be departing, and the frequency that's used for flight following out of that airport. At Class B/C airports, the flight following can be coordinated on the ground, after which you will be assigned a dep freq, so even that doesn't need to be researched in advance. For Class D airports, I've found they will generally coordinate it for you if asked. Being conservative, though, it's not a terrible thing to do some pre-flight planning and find out the local departure frequency for your point of origin.

Annnnnnd that's about it Once you're in the air and talking to departure, one of two things will happen, you'll either receive advisories all the way to your destination, OR, they'll terminate your radar service because the next facility isn't taking the handoff, in which case you'll hear "radar services terminated, squawk VFR, for further advisories, try Socal Approach [frequency], frequency change approved."

You swap over to their frequency, and believe it or not, 9 times out of 10, you'll have no trouble getting flight following from them, despite them not taking the hand off from the previous facility.

You'll eventually be asked to report the field in sight, then you'll be handed to the tower, you'll receive your pattern entry instruction, and eventually a landing clearance. You'll then either stay with the tower, monitor ground, or be told to contact ground.

Having a short workflow will greatly speed up the planning process, allowing you to plan flights with little warning, or handle changes in plans with aplomb.

I recall being taught in the pre-GPS days that VFR pilots who use the aircraft for actual cross country flights (as opposed to the pilot who never leaves the local pattern) to carry with him/her an IFR en route chart, for these charts contain center and approach frequencies (typically placed near a VOR on the chart) should a VFR pilot want to contact ATC for flight following or even a pop-up IFR clearance (if so rated):



However, these days in real life a pilot with either a good VFR GPS or a panel mounted IFR GPS is able to retrieve a nearby frequency by using the proper NEAREST page on the GPS. In FSX this is more or less simulated if you have the RealityXP Garmin GNS430 or 530 add-on GPS in your cockpit. I am not sure what is available in X-Plane.



Note that neither of the above methods are guaranteed, for often your altitude or your location may place you in another controller's airspace that is not depicted on any pilot accessible chart, but most controllers in real life (and I suspect, in PE) will provide you the correct frequency for your location should you "call the number" printed on the chart or in the GPS and discover it is not the one needed. But the GPS or the IFR chart are good starting points, for sure. This is why you should include your location with your initial call-up when airborne (and not already in contact with ATC), as the controller will then know immediately if you are in his/her airspace or some adjacent controller's airspace.

To Keith's point, while it is a good exercise in theory to research frequencies, in real life the shortcuts above combined with your experiences of flying a few times through a few airspaces and remembering what frequencies are used will trump the theory.

Peter,

Bear in mind, the low-enroute charts only show the enroute frequencies (centers), not the TRACON frequencies. Socal has enormous TRACON coverage (Socal, Bakersfield, Santa Barabara, Joshua, Las Vegas, etc), such that the freq on the enroute chart is often not the one you'll be on, unless you're above TRACON's airspace (BFL and SBA TRACONs only go up to 8k, for example).

You can certainly use that info in a pinch, though, and the center will happily provide you with the local TRACON frequency to try.

A reliable way to look up the frequency of a facility that provides radar service at a particular field is to use the data from the AFD (also accessible from airnav, skyvector, etc) to see if approach/departure freqs are published, or you can pull up any approach plate for the airport and use the facility frequency listed at the top of the chart. If there are no approaches at the field in question, you can use the closest airport that does have approaches published.

I've had great luck with the Garmin 420 in my airplane using the airport information pages to look up local departure frequencies. Sometimes I do it just out of interest after receiving a frequency from the ground controller. So far, it's matched 100% of the time.

Keith Smith wrote:You can certainly use that info in a pinch, though, and the center will happily provide you with the local TRACON frequency to try.

Funny, I was also going to type "happily provide" but then I reconsidered and removed that word - sometimes center isn't too happy as they are providing info to a wayward VFR pilot. Must be all that NY airspace flying that's corrupted my opinion.

BeechV35Pilot wrote: Must be all that NY airspace flying that's corrupted my opinion.

They have no time to be happy.

* Orest

Thanks for all the tips! I love hearing that I am doing too much work. I am slowly learning the ropes and have built a ton of confidence in a short period of time. The training program is very helpful! Coming from VATSIM and strictly flying IFR seems easy in comparison to flying VFR in the LAX area, but that is changing. Aviate, Navigate then Communicate are words to live by. I just bought the Reality XP 530 and am having fun toying with it and it makes airspace navigation SO much easier. I mainly fly the Carenado Cessna 210. So now, with your help, I can plan a flight more quickly without deciphering a chart for frequencies which has cut down a lot of planning and anxiety! At first I didn't understand Pilot Edge, but now I do. Keep up the good work and I will continue to use this valuable tool to help give me the confidence to jump start my real world PPL training this summer. My local sectional (KVPS)still confuses me, but ill figure it out...lol http://skyvector.com/?ll=30.47923809117 ... =34&zoom=2 <---gonna have to battle with the F-35s soon!

Yours Truly,
Eagle Eyes.....