My issues with all things FMS.

[djrisc]

Hey all,
So I recently started trying my hand at flying in aircraft other than little Cessna's, etc on PE. (IE. aircraft that have FMS's)

I have to say that the implementation of FMS's frustrates me to no end. First most of the aircraft that I have purchased have not so great instructions on it, and it seems like every route is very hit or miss. Am I wrong in thinking this?

For example, with a route like this: KSAN MZB293R SLI148R SLI KLAX (which is SANN4 TEC route btw.)

There appears to be no way of inputing radials and or LONG/LATS in to the FMS of any aircraft I have.. Do I just have to avoid these routes all together, or am forced to toss out the FMS and fly it by hand? (seems slightly unrealistic.)

Right now I'm attempting to learn this process on the following aircraft:

- Flight 1 King Air 200
- Flight 1 Citation Mustang
- Aerosoft Airbus X Extended

The Airbus FMS actually frustrated me so much that I finally stopped even trying to fly it, as it seems to be missing all kinds of information in it from SID/STAR transitions to waypoints. (and this is AFTER I paid to get the navigation updates!)

Any advice would be hugely appreciated as I'm going nuts.

Brett

[sronayne96]

Brett,

I'm no expert on the FMS. In fact, the only aircraft I've ever flown on PE that has one is the King Air C90 and I rarely use it because it's the default X-Plane FMS which is awful. However I believe that the MZB293R SLI148R SLI is the PEBLE4 departure out of KSAN. As far as I'm aware you can just go to the DEP/ARR section of the FMS and select PEBLE4 as your STAR. You'll also have to select a transition which in this case is the SLI transition. I don't know the specifics of each aircraft but I believe in the airbus anyway once you have entered that into the FMS the airplane will automatically fly that departure.
Hope that helps in some way,

Seán

[julio.elizalde]

Hi Brett,

If we look at the route you mentioned: KSAN MZB293R SLI148R SLI KLAX alongside the PEBLE4 DP with SLI transition, you'll see it's exactly the same. You can virtually use the same DP in the FMS and use the altitude requirements stipulated in your TEC route clearance. Also, with any DP that uses this type of interception of radials, you should be able to track those by setting your NAV radio and CRS selectors to the correct freq/course and then using the LOC or VOR function of your autopilot to track the radial.

[djrisc]

So as a pilot where is correlation made between a TEC route that gives you a bunch of Radial points and a departure? With the multitude of SIDS/STARS how does anyone possibly put that together without memorizing every plate?

Thanks for all the feedback it is VERY appreciated!

Brett

[twharrell]

Brett,

Your questions are good ones and they are valid. As for knowing whether a TEC route correlates to a SID, I think you'll find that only applies to a few airports, i.e ones in Class B or C airspace mostly. Unless you thumb through the DP's of your departure airport, you won't know. It is possible that in your IFR clearance you'll be assigned the SID by ATC, but I think I had that happen maybe once.

Regarding the use of FMS units: many FMS units in the real world allow you to enter user-created waypoints (so the intersection of MZB293R and SLI143R could be entered as a waypoint, for example). Not all FMS units in FSX and P3D will necessarily simulate this feature. If it is simulated, then the manual for your specific aircraft add-on should tell you. So, while in real life, you can create those waypoints with the G1000, that feature is not modeled in the G1000 included with the Flight 1 Mustang and King Air. I don't know if the MCDU in the Aerosoft Airbus models user-created waypoints or not (best to ask that question in the Aerosoft forums). I know the current Majestic Q400 does not include this feature, but I believe it will be included with the upcoming Pro edition. If you are into Boeings, the iFly and PMDG 737, and the PMDG 777 all include this feature. If you want a good regional jet that models it, look at the Feelthere ERJ's (nice little RJ, by the way).

But, let's face it - flying these the old fashioned way, using VOR and DME, is more fun anyway!

Todd

[Keith Smith]

Brett,

You're not expected to know off hand that the MZB293R SLI148R route mirrors the PEBLE4 SID. What will actually happen is that ATC will ASSIGN the PEBLE4 SID, which removes all of the mystery. The TEC route is AREA specific, not airport specific, that's why the TEC route doesn't contain the SID. Local procedure at SAN, however, has ATC assigning the SID in lieu of the MZB293 SLI148 route.

As to how to fly radials with the FMS, a real world FMS will allow you to enter routes of flight that comprise of radials and interactions of radials, but most simulated FMS do not.

Additionally, some FMS data is inaccurate when it comes to SIDs that involve cross radials prior to turning (such as the PEBLE4 at SAN, the PORTE at SFO and the CHANL SID at SNA). I put together 3 tutorial videos on those specific procedures: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=3302

They might give you some insight into the method you can use to utilize VOR's in FMS-equipped aircraft.

[djrisc]

Cool! I will check the videos out!

Thanks for everyone's feedback!

Brett

[Ryan B]

The PMDG NGX's FMS can do radials/fixes etc but that's about the only one I really know of that can. The Flight1 King air can go into OBS mode during RNAV (GPSS) and you can change your OBS and the pink line will rotate about the fix. Reality XP GNS will also do the same. But for that the best is to setup NAV1 as MZB293R and NAV2 as SLI148R and when they intercept you're at PEBLE.