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The only ILS approach for the KSJC San Jose 30 runways has a speed restriction at KLIDE of 230K. Does this mean that aircraft that are not capable of 230K cannot fly the ILS approach?

The chart I'm looking at: https://skyvector.com/files/tpp/1801/pdf/00693IL30L.PDF

Caesar wrote:The only ILS approach for the KSJC San Jose 30 runways has a speed restriction at KLIDE of 230K. Does this mean that aircraft that are not capable of 230K cannot fly the ILS approach?

The chart I'm looking at: https://skyvector.com/files/tpp/1801/pdf/00693IL30L.PDF

I'm guessing that's a typo. They've happened before. It's not uncommon to have a maximum speed restriction on an ILS (a solid line above the speed), but not a 230K mandatory speed requirement (a line above and below the speed). Most GA planes wouldn't have a chance to meet that speed. Take a look at the ILS 28L into SFO, indicating a 230K max at the IAF's ARCHI and MENLO. My guess is that was the intention at KSJC. I'd say that's worth a call to the FAA or NACO.

I've posed this question on the Cirrus Owners and Pilot's Association forum. Several CFII's and ATP's have weighed in and NONE have seen this before on any approach plate. They are quite perplexed by it and also wonder if its a typo, except that it is also on the Jepp chart. They've noted that the 230K speed requirement at KLIDE is also on the SILCN FOUR and RAZZR FOUR arrivals into KSJC, so it may be on the ILS approach plate for consistency. But the problem with that theory is that it's not on the RNAV Y 30L and it's written as a max speed restriction (overscored 230K) at KLIDE on the RNAV Z 30L and RNAV Z 30R. Makes absolutely no sense. A lot of smart guys are scratching their heads on this one. Any ideas Keith? If not maybe ask Jeff Van West?

I've just sent an email to the FAA on this. They have a website specifically for this purpose:

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_ ... repancies/

My comment:

"The ILS approach for the KSJC San Jose Rwy 30 has a mandatory speed restriction at KLIDE of 230K (overscored and underscored 230K). This means that aircraft that are not capable of 230K cannot fly the ILS approach without ATC dispensation. Is this a charting error that was intended to be only a maximum speed restriction? (overscored line). Technically, as published, all aircraft that are unable to meet this speed requirement of 230K must notify ATC that they are "unable to meet the speed restriction at KLIDE" and then get dispensation from ATC every time this approach is flown, which includes most GA aircraft. I'd appreciate a reply on this. Thank you very much."

Rod, thanks for the hard work on this! I hope the FAA gets back to you.

Response back already; less than 24 hours.

Control Number 27946 has been assigned to this issue for tracking purposes.
This concern has been closed with the following Response:

Roderick,

This is not a chart error. The CHARTED AT/ABOVE 4000 AND AT 230KIAS AT KLIDE was CHARTED AT PRIMARY USER REQUEST IN ORDER TO CORRECTLY TIE INTO STAR RESTRICTIONS IN ORDER TO ALLEVIATE FMS CONNECTIVITY ISSUES. This was copied directly from the procedure amendment. I know this does not solve the issue with all others not flying the STAR to ILS, but it was an FMS connectivity issue. Thank you for the inquiry.

Regards,

Marlon Robinson
Manager
Phone: (405) 954-3636

rtataryn wrote:(From Marlon Robinson,)... I know this does not solve the issue with all others not flying the STAR to ILS...

There is no issue since ATC can delete any published restrictions.

Sorry I didn't sooner, Rod, have been spread pretty thin with emails and support of late. I wouldn't have had any insight on this one other than thinking it was somehow related to the correlated restriction on the STAR....but even so, I wouldn't have known it to appease the gods that build the FMCs.

My other thought would also have been that pretty much the only people flying it from GILRO would be those on the STAR. Pistons and local flights would likely get vectored in any case (you're not going to have a 172 on a 17 mile straight in at any airport with any significant volume of jet traffic. At that point, the speed restriction is out of play anyway.

Excellent topic, very interesting!

Mudhen wrote:

rtataryn wrote:(From Marlon Robinson,)... I know this does not solve the issue with all others not flying the STAR to ILS...

There is no issue since ATC can delete any published restrictions.

Certainly. It is not a problem at all for slower airplanes to do this approach. The "issue" is that, as charted, it is technically incumbent upon the pilot to state that they can't make the speed if assigned this approach, or risk a bust for missing the speed.