"...Radar Vectors XYZ, Direct"

[jtek]

If I were to file the route "KSNA SLI POM KSNA" , but the clearance I got was "cleared to KSNA via fly heading 220 vectors SLI, direct" -- then (in the case of lost comms) would I be expected to fly to SLI, then skip POM and start my approach from SLI (as a feeder for SAGER), or would I be expected to continue to POM (as an IAF for KSNA that's on my route)?

Based upon your definition above I think I'd be expected to start the approach from SLI-->SAGER, rather than continuing to POM (because that is the most 'direct' to my clearance limit). Yes? No?

-M.

You are correct. In this scenario, the clearance you were given was a full route clearance (evidenced by the lack of the words "as filed" in the clearance), which takes precedence over what you filed. So even though you filed POM, it wasn't part of your clearance so it's basically irrelevant.

[julio.elizalde]

If you filed KSNA SLI POM KSNA and heard "cleared to the John Wayne Airport, fly heading 220, vectors SLI, direct" - that clearance would in fact be an amendment to your filed route. It would revert you back to KSNA SLI KSNA.

If the controller were authorizing you for the initial flight plan, you would hear: "cleared to the John Wayne Airport, fly heading 220, vectors SLI, then as filed" or "vectors SLI, direct POM, direct," depending on how wordy the controller chooses to be.

SLI is used as the standard routing for SNA to SNA since it serves a major departure VOR from the airport and doubles as a feeder for the ILS19R.

[Mark Hargrove]

Excellent -- that completely makes sense to me now.

Thanks to everybody who helped me get this concept beat into my head! I don't know why I struggled with it so much, but I'm pretty sure I've got it now.

-M.

[Vincent Meier]

So let me make sure I am following this discussion. All this dangling direct is only in the case of lost comms? Correct?

[Anthony Santanastaso]

So let me make sure I am following this discussion. All this dangling direct is only in the case of lost comms? Correct?

It is to connect the route to your clearance limit; the final link or step so that, yes, if you lose comms, you can proceed to the airport after the last navigational fix.

[Vincent Meier]

Thanks Anthony,
That was my assumption, but it was not always stated in each of the replies. It is clear to me now also.

[lingo480]

Wow, thanx so much for all the great info in this thread! Mark, I was having the same difficulty based on a clearance to KSFO the other night; decided to google my question and this thread came up #1...moral of the story I suppose is, I should have headed to the Pilot Edge forum 'direct'.

Thanx again,

Laurie Ingalls (lingo 480)