r/w visit to JFK

[Keith Smith]

I had the opportunity to fly a single engine piston into JFK for business yesterday (meeting a PE commercial prospect, in fact). The arrival was fun, vectors to a right base for 22R (I was coming from the SW) parallel with a 737 for 22L. I kept the speed as long as possible to minimize time on final, dropping the gear at 125kts about 1/2 mile from the runway, then approach flaps over the displaced threshold and finally full flaps over the numbers. I was going to skip the flaps all together, but this got me down sooner.

What followed was a taxi to the GA ramp (west end of 13R) that took almost as long as the flight itself.

On the way out, they held an A-380 short of the GA ramp so I could get out ahead of him. I can only assume this was for wake turb issues.





Evidently, we fly for the same airline

The departure was simple, called clearance, received VFR dep instructions with a heading, alt, freq and squawk, then call gnd for taxi. Once I was with departure, it was a series of headings over to COL VOR until I was out of the Bravo at 5.5k.

If any NE pilots have the chance to do it, I recommend it, it's a fun experience.

[Orest Skrypuch]

Nice pics, but I have to say the A380 kind of reminds of the creature from the Alien movie. It is butt ugly. Doesn't have the elegance of the slide-rule designed 747.

What time of day did you arrive/leave?

Later on and into the evening getting an IFR slot can take a long time, due to the international traffic -- VFR would make it a lot easier, and then if necessary, picking up IFR once outside the area -- although for you, it would be just a literal hop over the water, right? I have heard that JFK is indeed relatively friendly for GA for a large airport, as long as you're not there during its busy time. I do plan on flying in some time, combined with a visit to the city.

I had occasion to fly into Boston for a conference, and dearly wanted to fly into the downtown Logan. But, the $170/night ramp fee (ramp, not hangar!) drove me to Bedford in the periphery. For Chicago, Midway is a great place to fly into, cheap and very easy to get downtown.

* Orest

[Ryan B]

Did you get a video of that? Love those divx vids...

[Alex Stjepanovic]

On the way out, they held an A-380 short of the GA ramp so I could get out ahead of him. I can only assume this was for wake turb issues.

Of course they held him! Keith you as a controller of many thousands of hours, are quite well aware of the dangers of wake turbulence.

Had they released him before the 25 mins were up, that thing would have been the new ornament at the old TWA terminal. When you have gigantic piles of plastic like that moving around, you can't take any risks!

[BeechV35Pilot]

Very, very cool. Thanks for posting your experience and pictures.

What did you have to do to fly into JFK? Did you fly in IFR? My understanding is that there are only a limited number of IFR slots during the day and those have to be reserved ahead of time?

[Keith Smith]

Orest, agreed, there is not much to like about the appearance of the A-380. It was my first time seeing one in person. I arrived at 10:08am (well, that's what time I arrived at the front desk at the FBO...I probably landed 10 mins before that, the taxi was CRAZY long). I left at 2pm'ish. Peak is 3pm-10pm there. That's where they tack on a $100 Stay the Hell Away fee, it works VERY well!

My favorite moment was when they asked me if they could relocate the plane about 30ft away. I said, "sure, where do you want it?" They pointed to a spot and I pushed the plane by hand. They said, "Well, that's a first." Ironically, at EXACTLY the same time, a Cargolux 747 was pushing out of the cargo ramp not far away and starting up. They had a bit more help, though.

I arrived VFR (just barely, vis was horrible), and departed VFR (vis much better). It DID take a 7-8 mins before I was issued my VFR departure instructions, though. That's by far the longest I've ever waited for something like that. I was running with engine off and canopy open just taking in the view, though, so no biggie.

Beech dude. The slot reservation system is gone at JFK, afaik. I flew in VFR (this is the second time I've done it that way, too).

I'll see if I can find some of the ATC recordings on liveatc.net.

[Keith Smith]

I received some email inquiries from some friends in the Lancair community and gave them a slightly more detailed write up. I figured I'd post it here, too:

Departed Lincoln Park, transitioned Caldwell heading towards Newark Liberty (EWR), called EWR's VFR tower freq 127.85 (freq is on the TAC chart, just SE of the airport), requested transition of EWR, landing JFK. Got radar identified, cleared into Bravo, transitioned the 22L/R numbers at EWR at 1500ft (standard for south ops. If it was north ops it would've been the 4L/R numbers), then towards Statue of Liberty, then right turn to the VZ bridge and handed off to JFK tower, cleared into Bravo, vectored east for a bit at 1000ft, then set up for a right base to 22R, following a 737 that was on a left base for 22L.

Only interesting point was that I was assigned 500ft initially along the beach, then was assigned a NE heading to avoid some oncoming helicopters and point me towards JFK, along with a climb to 1000ft. A slow turn to the heading would've resulted in overflying a good number of houses just inland of the beach. I employed a 60 deg bank to get the turn over and done with quickly, avoiding the built-up area and instead taking me over a wide inlet behind all the houses. No, I didn't yell "woohoo!" while I was doing it...there wasn't time

Slowed to around around 150kts in the vicinity of JFK until lined up with 22R, then slowed to 125kts (max gear extension speed) by about 1 mile from the start of the 22R displaced threshold. Approach flap over the displaced threshold, then full flap over the numbers. Exited runway and taxied to the GA terminal (up near the 13R numbers).

Departure was easy, call delivery, request VFR to N07 through the Bravo. VFR departure instructions were hdg 185, vfr @ 2.5k with a squawk and a freq. Called for taxi, snapped the pic of the A-380, was at 13R in no time (got lucky that they'd swapped to 13R for deps while I was parked there, otherwise, would've been a long taxi to 22R). Swapped to tower, took off, accelerated to 150kts on the deck then started a cruise climb turned right to the heading. Swapped to departure, issued climb to 5.5k and a new hdg, 220. Once above the 13L arrival stream, I was pointed towards COL VOR, just outside of the Bravo.

After that, it was just regular flight following back to N07. They cleared me back into the Bravo at 3.5 direct MMU direct N07.