Possible radio failure?

[Bidimus]

This was an odd one. I went up for a practice attempt at my V-2 yesterday during the busy hour. There must have been close to 25 planes in the air at the time. Then something odd happened when I was handed off to Socal Approach on my way to Ontario.

Here is the audio of that passage. My comm starts at about 6:15. I"m N7019G.
http://assets.pilotedge.net/recordings/ ... _17010.mp3

I was thrown off at first with the instruction about staying left of 20L due to nerves and it being a new instruction I wasn't expecting. I got that corrected though once I sunk in what she was saying and was fine. After that though she hands me off to SoCal App and things get weird. I was on course to Ontario and thought I was with App but it became clear that wasn't the case a couple calls later when she asked me to switch to App again. The radio was tuned correctly though. I rechecked a couple times. Eventually I was literally on top of Ontario when she handed me off to tower. I'm still not clear if she was able to hear me or not.

Has anyone else had this happen to them before? Could it have been a glitch with PilotEdge? What would the backup plan be for when radios are failing short of disconnecting (which I was just about to do when I was over Ontario)?

On a side note, I actually took my V-2 later in the evening when it was less busy and passed. Loving PE.

[Keith Smith]

I was flying at the same time (if memory serves). The approach controller may have lost her connection briefly because I was unable to raise her for about 30-45 seconds as well. She came back shortly after and it was back to business as usual.

I would go through standard lost comms procedures which would include trying the previous frequency, trying a nearby tower, or trying Guard (121.50). If all else fails, squawk 7600 and continue the flight, monitoring the appropriate frequency as best you're able.

[Bidimus]

Thanks. Transitioning from offline to online as a sim only pilot, emergency and contingency procedures are pretty much foreign to me still. I'm learning though.

So to clarify, previous frequency I hadn't considered and makes sense for a first resort. Nearby tower makes sense and in fact I had considered switching to Ontario when I felt like I was running out of time. What is Guard? That one is unfamiliar to me.

Squawking 7600 I didn't know about. (I just Googled it) I'll have to file that one away. Now I had following and radar contact confirmed so I assumed I was still on radar. Hypothetically, had things still come to a head, would it have been wise to switch from my assigned code to 7600 for the comm failure in that case?

[wmburns]

So to clarify, previous frequency I hadn't considered and makes sense for a first resort. Nearby tower makes sense and in fact I had considered switching to Ontario when I felt like I was running out of time. What is Guard? That one is unfamiliar to me.

Squawking 7600 I didn't know about. (I just Googled it) I'll have to file that one away. Now I had following and radar contact confirmed so I assumed I was still on radar. Hypothetically, had things still come to a head, would it have been wise to switch from my assigned code to 7600 for the comm failure in that case?

Just to confirm that you were on a VFR flight at the time AND you were within 10 miles of the destination tower right?

Remember there are some differences between VFR and IFR flights. The controller is only providing traffic advisories to the VFR pilot. Maintaining VFR is still ultimately your responsibility.

To me it seems as a VFR pilot within the tower control zone the first action after loosing approach comms should be to call tower. Not a bad idea to report lost communication with Approach.

Squawking 7600 implies that you couldn't raise anybody at all despite multiple attempts to.

Welcome aboard.

[Bidimus]

That makes sense. Ya I was VFR but I did have flight following and was within the Class C. I think that's what made it so worrisome. In my mind what made being in the class C ok was that I was with approach. Once I wasn't sure if I was or not, I felt like I was in a grey area. That's why I held my course, I felt like they had me on radar and knew my course and intention. It seemed best to stick to that as long as feasible.

[wmburns]

That's why I held my course, I felt like they had me on radar and knew my course and intention. It seemed best to stick to that as long as feasible.

To me this ^^^ implies that you may not fully understand the fundamental differences between ATC's role to the VFR verses the IFR pilot.

Question. Were you given the ATC instruction, "Resume own navigation. Maintain VFR"?

When the differences between VFR and IFR flights are fully appreciated then to the VFR pilot, there is absolutely zero gray area regarding what do under the situation. The first action after loosing approach comms is to call tower under the situation outlined.

The fact that you felt it necessary to hold course because you were under radar control implies the thinking of an IFR pilot.

[Bidimus]

That's why I held my course, I felt like they had me on radar and knew my course and intention. It seemed best to stick to that as long as feasible.

To me this ^^^ implies that you may not fully understand the fundamental differences between ATC's role to the VFR verses the IFR pilot.

This is entirely possible as I'm new to all this. That's why I'm here asking questions. My understanding is that the VFR pilot, under their own navigation, is responsible for their own route, adherence to regulations, and is always responsible for their own traffic separation.

That said, ATC's role to the VFR pilot is different when the Pilot specifically asks for Radar Advisory and it would seem more so when you're in their controlled airspace. It's different from IFR where you go strictly as instructed/planned as necessary. Am I wrong about this?

Question. Were you given the ATC instruction, "Resume own navigation. Maintain VFR"?

When the differences between VFR and IFR flights are fully appreciated then to the VFR pilot, there is absolutely zero gray area regarding what do under the situation. The first action after loosing approach comms is to call tower under the situation outlined.

I'm not clear exactly at what point I lost comms. Or even if I did. I could hear them talking to others. I could hear them talk to me. I'm still not sure if when I was handed off to the tower at the end if they heard me copy the frequency change. If I only got silence, static, or even a dark radio I could say I lost comms and it was time for plan B. But due to a lack of familiarity with PE and the symptoms I was seeing created a grey area. The VFR pilot should not, to my understand, change frequencies away from ATC unless instructed. IF I was still with them, then changing to tower could have been bad. IF comm actually did fail then changing to tower next would make sense. All of this of course was the first time I had ever experienced such a situation though in my life so I was totally winging it on top of an already over inflated case of nerves.

The fact that you felt it necessary to hold course because you were under radar control implies the thinking of an IFR pilot.

No, I said that due to fact I didn't know if I had comm and that I was in class C is why I held course. Holding course made sense because it was a known destination and that I was already being track on radar. As it was, they came in at the end and handed me straight over to tower so obviously this worked.